Dreams #1
Gameinformer November Cover Revealed ? Dreams
Archive: 138 posts
| With LittleBigPlanet, Media Molecule built its reputation on giving players a toolset to make zany, memorable levels that caught the attention of both creators and users everywhere. With Dreams, the developer takes things to the next level with an accessible, creative suite that allows players to create nearly any game they envision alongside a social space for collaborating with other users and sharing their creations with the greater world. We recently took a trip to Guilford, England to see if Dreams could live up to such ridiculous ambitions. Our November issue chronicles the sights and sounds we saw (and made) in Dreams and outlines why we came away believing in the promise of Media Molecule?s bold vision. We have exclusive details on the game?s story mode, tools, and much more. Starting this week we?ll also have exclusive online content to support the story, including features, interviews, and gameplay footage. https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/10...evealed-dreams | 2018-10-02 18:02:00 Author: Lbphart3  Posts: 813 |
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2pH2abOtyg Stop frame of putting a level together https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1047227740942991360 The cover was entirely made in Dreams: https://twitter.com/gameinformer/status/1047160354671800321 - - - - - - - - - - 229 rapid fire questions: https://www.gameinformer.com/exclusive-video/2018/10/03/229-rapid-fire-questions-about-dreams-0 - - - - - - - - - - That detail: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DoqxKP6UcAA25zR.jpg - - - - - - - - - - https://i.imgur.com/t4UiLse.gif - - - - - - - - - - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRv1ir5KT_U&list=LLJ2KxLcdOl4IAqfBHPIjupw&t=0s&index=2 - - - - - - - - - - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwgb1tI91VA - - - - - - - - - - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2SHl_TR-6_4 | 2018-10-05 18:02:00 Author: GribbleGrunger  Posts: 3910 |
| Holy crap. Some of those clips are outstanding. AND. THAT. GIF. | 2018-10-06 18:46:00 Author: koltonaugust  Posts: 1382 |
| Holy crap. Some of those clips are outstanding. AND. THAT. GIF. Yeah, Dreams is everything the LBP community were asking for ... and some. https://i.imgur.com/gNqkpId.gif Fish: https://i.imgur.com/phVxXeJ.gif https://i.imgur.com/GPP6TYg.gif Watch those pallets and remember, there's NO water physics in this game and that water is only made of paint strokes: https://i.imgur.com/UmcJv1B.gif https://i.imgur.com/EYkZBpe.gif | 2018-10-07 16:36:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I can't tell if that first gif is VR or the person just doesn't know how to control the camera... | 2018-10-08 07:52:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Cool gifs and images. I think the First Person game has some cool animations. Head bobbing is a good thing. | 2018-10-08 20:43:00 Author: mdkd99  Posts: 1172 |
| Nothing much today. Just an introduction to the characters: https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/10/07/here-are-the-characters-in-dreams-story-mode https://s3.amazonaws.com/prod-media.gameinformer.com/styles/body_default/s3/2018/10/07/c315c4f3/frances_foxy_vista2.jpg | 2018-10-08 22:24:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| The characters sound interesting. I'm looking forward to see these characters in action. Also, I love the tree model in the background. | 2018-10-09 01:43:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| An interview with Siobhan Reddy https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-10-09-making-games-is-just-the-beginning-for-media-molecules-dreams - - - - - - - - - - Why isn't Dreams out yet. Vid: https://www.gameinformer.com/exclusive-interview/2018/10/10/why-isnt-media-molecules-dreams-out-yet - - - - - - - - - - https://imgur.com/ed68AW1.gif - - - - - - - - - - Time laps building: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1050109494913568770 | 2018-10-10 23:03:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| My god! My hands are gonna melt to my PS4 controller when this comes out!  | 2018-10-11 02:24:00 Author: comishguy67  Posts: 849 |
| I'm having an interesting discussion with Peter Fields (formally ND employee). He explained that the 'space' takes up thermo. So if you build a building wall by wall, feature by feature, it takes up far less space than if you took a square and then added a space to create a room. Here's the optimisation tool in action. I'd also suggest reading through the thread: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1050316589604712448 | 2018-10-11 12:21:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| So you're 55? Anyway, so basically what he's saying is, that using individuell walls is cheaper than hollowing out the place to create one 4 sided wall. It sounds complicated. Also, lowering resolution probably makes the splats on a object bigger, or just blurry because resolution is lower. That is probably one of the only textures we have in the game in addition to the UI elements, skybox and stuff. What he said about emitters also confuses me and worries me. I don't think it will be impossible to emit a scenery object and develop a LOD technique in Dreams. Basically you could do this for trees and houses. A tree could have a very low resolution when the player is 100 meters away and the leaves are just a green thing instead of highly detailed individual leaves. When the player comes closer the tree gets higher resolution and more detailed. Same with houses. Don't know if that works flawless. Also, wetness is a thing. Is it fluidly changeable with logic? Have to check the streams again. | 2018-10-11 14:33:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| So you're 55? Anyway, so basically what he's saying is, that using individuell walls is cheaper than hollowing out the place to create one 4 sided wall. It sounds complicated. Also, lowering resolution probably makes the splats on a object bigger, or just blurry because resolution is lower. That is probably one of the only textures we have in the game in addition to the UI elements, skybox and stuff. What he said about emitters also confuses me and worries me. I don't think it will be impossible to emit a scenery object and develop a LOD technique in Dreams. Basically you could do this for trees and houses. A tree could have a very low resolution when the player is 100 meters away and the leaves are just a green thing instead of highly detailed individual leaves. When the player comes closer the tree gets higher resolution and more detailed. Same with houses. Don't know if that works flawless. Also, wetness is a thing. Is it fluidly changeable with logic? Have to check the streams again. No, I'm 60. | 2018-10-11 16:37:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I'm surprised how age really doesn't play a role in LBP or Dreams. People would be called weird, if they played 'Kids games' when being adults, but in creative games like these it doesn't matter and that's a good thing. Anyway, I think if you save objects like trees in different LOD stages, you can emit them in different stages with some simple logic. I don't see this not being a thing. | 2018-10-12 05:14:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| OoOooooooooooooold! Nah, i'm jk. I think MM has family games down. I wouldn't call their stuff kids games as they're not really dumbed down. It's just colorful. Tearaway was their closest game to a kids game, but even that was more gimmicky than kiddy. Basically what I think he is saying though is that the sculptures don't use vertices to determine its shape, but voxels which is basically a grid, so to speak. Each part on this grid has info about the sculpture. Because he hollowed out the walls, this evenly spaced grid now must store that empty space as empty whereas with vertices you wouldn't. Imagine a square that you hollowed out a square in LBP. That would only have to store the 8 points and the texture whereas in Dreams (im assuming) each point in the hollowed part has to be recorded and lowering the resolution would change the size of the hole because there's less "space" points and each point would fill up more space in the sculpture. Voxel games include (technically) minecraft (the terrain is stored as voxels), subnautica (I believe it's still in the game if you use console, but terraforming), and pretty much anything that places really heavy emphasis on sculpting or terrain altering, but it has to be the main feature usually. On a related note: I'M SO FRICKIN EXCITED THIS IS IN THE GAAAAAAAAAAME!!!! The dephysicalize tool was my second favorite (behind analogue note functionality) additions to LBPV! I'm worried and relieved about the emitter news. On the down side: no more squeezing everything into a level. On the plus side: if level transitions work as well as they say they do, we can focus on bigger chunks of the level rather than the small. This could mean larger "open" worlds that send some data about where the player entered the next location from Cell A ------------------------> Cell B __________`````````````````__________ |xxxxxx^xxx|```````````````|xxxxxxxxxx| |xxxxxxxxxx|``````goes to```|xxxxxxxxxx| |xxxxxxxxxx|``````------->```|xxxxxxxxxx| |xxxxxxxxxx|```````````````|xxxxxx^xxx| The `'s are for formatting and the x's are just space in a cell. The ^ would be the player looking a direction at a certain placement. And of course I'm just speculating. | 2018-10-12 12:05:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Storing data: https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1049716789360414720 Signal Transmitter/Receiver: https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1050511129968107520 Automatic edit removal: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1050401365665730560 https://abload.de/img/screenshot-www.youtubqufze.jpg https://abload.de/img/screenshot-www.youtubtuf00.jpg - - - - - - - - - - New video. As always, I'll post the Youtube version up as soon as it's available: https://www.gameinformer.com/exclusive-video/2018/10/12/watch-us-make-a-bizarre-game-with-media-molecules-dreams - - - - - - - - - - Full version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_N_LdPjvzc - - - - - - - - - - In the full length video there is something very interesting. As they were looking through the settings in the mannequin, they came across a section named 'structure'. In this section there was a panel and upon it a human form made out of bone icons. That, to me, very much looks like a panel we can control, changing the shape of the mannequin by moving the bone icons around. - - - - - - - - - - https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DpUyT1LXcAAI_jO.jpg | 2018-10-12 23:34:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I love this thread. Thanks for gethering all this info GribbleGrunger! This is all the info I've been waiting to have confirmed as it's kind of where I thought they were going based off of the LBP series progress, but it still always surprises me about just how big of a step up these tools are. Also, I love that tentacle and devil imp! Can anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but you can edit the imp right? I remember hearing that a long time ago, but none of the demos have shown it and had people pick from a selection instead. The bone thing scares me a bit, but super glad it's in game. I'm just afraid of a bunch of stretching and weird animations. | 2018-10-13 02:12:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I love this thread. Thanks for gethering all this info GribbleGrunger! This is all the info I've been waiting to have confirmed as it's kind of where I thought they were going based off of the LBP series progress, but it still always surprises me about just how big of a step up these tools are. Also, I love that tentacle and devil imp! Can anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but you can edit the imp right? I remember hearing that a long time ago, but none of the demos have shown it and had people pick from a selection instead. The bone thing scares me a bit, but super glad it's in game. I'm just afraid of a bunch of stretching and weird animations. Yes, you can edit the imp but we've not seen it yet. I would imagine, because the imp is something we use right from the very introduction, that it's something we have access to immediately and it hasn't been shown because they don't want to show the beginning of the game. More interesting snippets: More on Receivers/Transmitters: https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1050801646354255872 Expanding on the Mannequin: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1050898023037984768 - - - - - - - - - - Youtube version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEvhuDg12jQ | 2018-10-13 18:12:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
I really appreciate that they're letting Peter Field answer all of these questions, and that he's taking the time to do so. Also, GREAT questions Gribble. I hadn't even thought about half of these, but everything I've wanted to know. Super happy to hear that about bones as now we can create super adorable SPIDERS  https://imgix.ranker.com/user_node_img/50074/1001460440/original/d-photo-u1?w=650&q=50&fm=jpg&fit=crop&crop=faces | 2018-10-13 18:39:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I really appreciate that they're letting Peter Field answer all of these questions, and that he's taking the time to do so. Also, GREAT questions Gribble. I hadn't even thought about half of these, but everything I've wanted to know. Super happy to hear that about bones as now we can create super adorable SPIDERS https://imgix.ranker.com/user_node_img/50074/1001460440/original/d-photo-u1?w=650&q=50&fm=jpg&fit=crop&crop=faces I've got many more but I don't want to bother him too much LOL. I'll leave it a few days and try digging a little deeper. - - - - - - - - - - About the sculpt thermo: https://twitter.com/Johnee_B/status/1051546429536251905 Follow up question about thermo use: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1051555643092594689 - - - - - - - - - - If there is no transparency in Dreams, just how have they made the glass in this door? https://media.giphy.com/media/csCgjTjBhrYBFIaxpZ/giphy.gif Awaiting an answer from a Tweet. - - - - - - - - - - About the glass: https://twitter.com/EcksAndWhy/status/1051739279108517889 More thermo: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1051819867119214592 - - - - - - - - - - The most fascinating tools in Dreams. (clearly a newbs view of the tools): https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/10/15/the-most-fascinating-tools-in-dreams - - - - - - - - - - No global optimiser: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1051890875670953984 - - - - - - - - - - Thermo with logic: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1051899548828872709 https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1051906858653487104 | 2018-10-15 19:57:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Thanks for asking those question, very nice of you. So you can place down bricks hundreds of times to create houses, which is cool. But I feel like doing that will impact the performance, if done too often, even without textures and very simple geometry. | 2018-10-15 20:43:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Awesome stuff! No, I'm 60. Wow, awesome! My mom's the same age and the last time I showed her one of my levels I couldn't even get her to hold the controller correctly. lol | 2018-10-15 22:03:00 Author: comishguy67 Posts: 849 |
| Thanks for asking those question, very nice of you. So you can place down bricks hundreds of times to create houses, which is cool. But I feel like doing that will impact the performance, if done too often, even without textures and very simple geometry. I think that was just a theoretical question in order to help understand the concept. As Peter pointed out in one of the first tweets, he didn't optimise the build when he made the house, he just hollowed out a square. Building it wall by wall would reduce the thermo by a lot because the space of the hollowed out square is still part of the thermo. If I was to approach a city sized level, I'd likely build a generic house (let's say with the frontage missing) and then emit a selection of frontages onto it for variety. Just like in real developing, it's going to be up to us to make sure the framerate is consistant but from what John said about cloning 100s if not 1000s of times, it doesn't affect the performance much, so I really don't think assets will be the main problem. I think logic is going to be one of the main problems. My idea of having a central complex logic system that uses the Transmitter/Receivers is going to help reduce the load. My example was putting 5 lifts in a level and using the central logic to control all 5 lifts with only basic logic on the lift itself to receive the data necessary and interpret it. Peter's answer seems to verify this is a good way of doing things. - - - - - - - - - - Character count needs to be taken seriously! https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1052059194931781632 | 2018-10-16 06:19:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I think using tags will work. It's a bit concerning. I love all the tools and I think a lot of things will be possible in Dreams, but not being able to create proper LOD technology to improve CPU usage due to the emitters loading in all the data even before a object is spawned or memorizers not existing in the game or complex logic on many characters being very heavy on the hardware makes it seem like Dreams will have some tight limits. I hope the story mode will make things a bit more clearer in terms of limits. | 2018-10-16 08:28:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
"Hopefully players wont hit the thermo cap for a really long time  " - CHALLENGE ACCEPTED! Bombs and lava EVERYWHERE.Also question as I don't have a twitter. For Animation, is there a setting to create points to which an object travels to instead of following my shaky hand's path? For instance an elevator. I wouldn't want that shaking around as its going down. I'd be surprised if they don't have it but I haven't seen it yet. @mdkd99 - I'm not sure if the Load On Demand (is that what it stands for?) is taken away with how they describe dream loading. If the server is good enough (plz PLZ be good enough) and the levels are small enough/designed well and loading is efficient, it should be better than the emitter workaround. | 2018-10-17 01:26:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| "Hopefully players wont hit the thermo cap for a really long time " - CHALLENGE ACCEPTED! Bombs and lava EVERYWHERE. Also question as I don't have a twitter. For Animation, is there a setting to create points to which an object travels to instead of following my shaky hand's path? For instance an elevator. I wouldn't want that shaking around as its going down. I'd be surprised if they don't have it but I haven't seen it yet. @mdkd99 - I'm not sure if the Load On Demand (is that what it stands for?) is taken away with how they describe dream loading. If the server is good enough (plz PLZ be good enough) and the levels are small enough/designed well and loading is efficient, it should be better than the emitter workaround. Yes, there are tools to create straight paths between points. You can see the tool being used here. You can see it has more options when it's placed down but I don't know what they do: https://youtu.be/j44wgbHGAvA?t=7m33s LOD = level of detail. EDIT: YOUTUBE DOWN AT THE MOMENT!! | 2018-10-17 01:43:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Weird. Never seen youtube down before like this. And that's great about the extra choices! I hated having to switch between the move (touch for vita) animator and movers/followers to do one animation in LBP | 2018-10-17 02:46:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Weird. Never seen youtube down before like this. And that's great about the extra choices! I hated having to switch between the move (touch for vita) animator and movers/followers to do one animation in LBP Those options are still available. I think the one thing some people are overlooking is the record function. That means we can set up complex logic and systems to accomplish complicated mechanics with platforms, record them, and then delete the logic! - - - - - - - - - - About the text tool: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1052464924545470465 Stop Frame animation: https://twitter.com/TheSuperSoupy/status/1052488852886233088 https://twitter.com/TheSuperSoupy/status/1052490498223599616 - - - - - - - - - - On character numbers: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1052607720896045056 https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1052607279604883457 - - - - - - - - - - On the text tool and emojis: https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1052088552815845376 On storing information: https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1049716789360414720 https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1052475620653969408 - - - - - - - - - - Todays Game Informer article: https://www.gameinformer.com/2018/10/17/how-media-molecule-hopes-dreams-can-go-beyond-just-games - - - - - - - - - - About HUDS: https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1052682728490065920 - - - - - - - - - - About the Calculator: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1052994286449545216 - - - - - - - - - - Madrid Event today so hopefully some new footage will be coming. - - - - - - - - - - New video article: https://www.gameinformer.com/exclusive-video/2018/10/15/media-molecules-designers-show-off-even-more-creations-in-dreams - - - - - - - - - - https://i.imgur.com/VzYwjvm.gif https://i.imgur.com/m96dCK7.gif https://i.imgur.com/0Xgduc3.gif About that splash effect: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1053340412172292096 Bonus for hype: https://i.imgur.com/SLLKEPL.gif | 2018-10-19 18:52:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Looks really amazing so far. I love how tools have multiple options to avoid big chunks of logic for simple features. So text for the UI is coming. Do we know how many font types there and how it works for 3D space? | 2018-10-20 19:20:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I'm scared to ask just because they've always said yes to everything, but for this I'd be the most surprised for if the answer is yes. Can you create your own fonts? Obviously you can create your own 3D text, but would you be able to use something like that for the text tool for faster use? | 2018-10-20 20:13:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I feel like that won't work. MM will probably add enough fonts, but I see where you're coming from. | 2018-10-20 21:32:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I'm scared to ask just because they've always said yes to everything, but for this I'd be the most surprised for if the answer is yes. Can you create your own fonts? Obviously you can create your own 3D text, but would you be able to use something like that for the text tool for faster use? Yes, of course you can make your own fonts! The GameInformer cover was made in Dreams and that font was custom made for it. https://s3.amazonaws.com/prod-media.gameinformer.com/styles/body_default/s3/2018/10/01/3e525f56/cover%20embed.png | 2018-10-20 22:17:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I am underestimating Dreams once again. So you can create your own fonts, not like in LBP with a few types of fonts? That's honestly really amazing. | 2018-10-20 22:52:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I am underestimating Dreams once again. So you can create your own fonts, not like in LBP with a few types of fonts? That's honestly really amazing. It's still going to be free hand a bit fiddly though. It's just made so much easier with the strokes tool. What I'm hoping for is a keyboard template with greyed out letters. You make your own font and place the letter in the right place. Then you plug that template into the text tool. If it's not there, it needs to be there. | 2018-10-20 23:33:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Jeez. I knew the answer would be yes, but now makes me feel like they haven't slept since before LBP2. I think that keyboard layout idea sounds great though! Would even allow for special characters. | 2018-10-21 00:25:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Reading through this thread is really getting me a lot more interested in Dreams, the game looks a lot more "solid" than I thought it would be. (If that makes any sense?) | 2018-10-22 06:10:00 Author: Silverleon  Posts: 6707 |
| Why MM wanted to make Dreams: https://www.gameinformer.com/exclusive-interview/2018/10/22/why-media-molecule-wanted-to-make-dreams | 2018-10-22 18:22:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| "The beta's already out by the way" -Mark "CREATOR ALPHA, CREATOR ALPHA, CREATOR ALPHA, CREATOR ALPHA" -Siobhan Siobhan trying to prevent mass panic. | 2018-10-23 08:55:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Youtube version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq3cacfA-yE | 2018-10-23 17:19:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| That's a cool intention to make games. 'The beta is already out by the way.' - 'Creator Alpha!' Haha, I think Mark also wants the Beta to be out as soon as possible. | 2018-10-23 17:54:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| It does make me wonder if they are going for a december/January beta and a summer release. Guess it depends on how the creator alpha is going. | 2018-10-23 22:40:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| It does make me wonder if they are going for a december/January beta and a summer release. Guess it depends on how the creator alpha is going. Naa, it's ready. They're just waiting for the best possible window to release it in. I think Nov for the beta, which will run for a long time to create content, and release in late Jan/ early Feb. | 2018-10-24 01:35:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| But do Jan/Feb releases do well? I know early summer ones often do. I'm not really sure how online games do throughout the year at all. | 2018-10-24 07:35:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| This is a game changer in my opinion: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1055011640264015872 - - - - - - - - - - But do Jan/Feb releases do well? I know early summer ones often do. I'm not really sure how online games do throughout the year at all. Yeah, many games have had a successful Feb launch. The reason Days Gone has been moved from Feb to April is because Feb is packed with big hitters such as Crackdown 3. Sony have taught the industry you don't have to pack the holiday season with EVERYTHING, you can spread what you have throughout the year. - - - - - - - - - - More on exit points: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1055080966585225216 https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1055085047122968576 - - - - - - - - - - Streaming across level is likely planned for a future update: https://twitter.com/marcoshealey/status/1055170968631631873 | 2018-10-24 21:02:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the exit things kind of the same as in LBP? You set up logic to activate a tag and a tag sensor receives that signal and activates the exit. I see why that would be important to many folks, but it's not a new thing, IF that's how it works. I am digging the transition thing. Loading times could be really good and entering a dungeon like in Fallout 4 could go in roughly 5 seconds, if I'm correct. Very cool news. | 2018-10-24 22:06:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the exit things kind of the same as in LBP? You set up logic to activate a tag and a tag sensor receives that signal and activates the exit. I see why that would be important to many folks, but it's not a new thing, IF that's how it works. I am digging the transition thing. Loading times could be really good and entering a dungeon like in Fallout 4 could go in roughly 5 seconds, if I'm correct. Very cool news. Similar yeah. The difference is that all LBP was doing is connecting the levels, in that it would load the correct level next on finishing. This is now fully integrated into Dreams and it doesn't just connect levels, it automatically starts loading the level when you are close to the exit, meaning load times are a second or two. Another big difference is you can have 100 levels per game, in each of those 100 levels you can have another 100 levels etc, to the power of 4. 100*100*100*100 = 100,000,000 levels. | 2018-10-24 22:59:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Wait, where'd you get those numbers from? Also, I'm not sure what you mean by 100 per level. Is that essentially 100 different levels links in one level? And where's the power of 4 coming from? Sorry I'm just feeling like I missed a good stream or something. | 2018-10-25 06:18:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I remember them saying, that you can make 100 levels in a adventure map, 100 adventure maps with 10000 levels in total on one adventure map and so on. So it's big. And the loading times are probably improved with this method. A lot. | 2018-10-25 11:26:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Wait, where'd you get those numbers from? Also, I'm not sure what you mean by 100 per level. Is that essentially 100 different levels links in one level? And where's the power of 4 coming from? Sorry I'm just feeling like I missed a good stream or something. https://youtu.be/VfM38g4Z8ns?t=1m21s | 2018-10-25 16:03:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| https://i.imgur.com/ycYmY9B.gif https://i.imgur.com/2dprEHj.gif https://i.imgur.com/xZgbWq9.gif | 2018-10-26 19:04:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Cool gifs! Also, I just relistened to the level limit explanation and it TECHNICALLY sounds like there is no limit as the power of 4 was an example. All it sounded like to me is that 100 levels can fit inside a map, but a map acts like a level too. | 2018-10-26 21:18:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Am watching the stream right now. Man, the soundtrack by Tom was really well made. It's all done in Dreams. Doesn't even sound amateur like. Imagine folks with a really good mic. They can record professional music with Dreams. I don't think totally professional people will use Dreams to make a business, but for me it's perfect. I can make my own sounds, instruments and maybe even vocals. The sound tool is very strong. The sounds you record have higher quality than mp3 and one CPU core is used for audio. That is very exciting. Also, the sculpting seems to be really fun. Kareem really enjoys using it and says that you just can't stop, because it's fun. I think I'll have a lot of fun, even with the normal DS4. You're getting used to it. First Person also looks like a really possible thing. The horror house was fun. The end of it was also really funny. What did you take away from the stream? | 2018-10-26 23:18:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Am watching the stream right now. Man, the soundtrack by Tom was really well made. It's all done in Dreams. Doesn't even sound amateur like. Imagine folks with a really good mic. They can record professional music with Dreams. I don't think totally professional people will use Dreams to make a business, but for me it's perfect. I can make my own sounds, instruments and maybe even vocals. The sound tool is very strong. The sounds you record have higher quality than mp3 and one CPU core is used for audio. That is very exciting. Also, the sculpting seems to be really fun. Kareem really enjoys using it and says that you just can't stop, because it's fun. I think I'll have a lot of fun, even with the normal DS4. You're getting used to it. First Person also looks like a really possible thing. The horror house was fun. The end of it was also really funny. What did you take away from the stream? I've got to be honest and say, I don't like watching the sculpting. I've seen in hundreds of times by now and only really look for new abilities and toolsets. The horse was a stand out to me and I'd like to know how it was able to follow the lay of the land. | 2018-10-27 00:27:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Sculpting is complex and probably hard to do at first, but I guess you'll get used to it. Well, you still have the other tools to work with, like the logic tools or the audio tools. Also, I think the horse might have a skeleton to support movement like that. While it was fairly simple, I liked the desert level. I'm thinking more and more about making a Mad Max like environment in LBP3 and Dreams. | 2018-10-27 00:37:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Sculpting is complex and probably hard to do at first, but I guess you'll get used to it. Well, you still have the other tools to work with, like the logic tools or the audio tools. Also, I think the horse might have a skeleton to support movement like that. While it was fairly simple, I liked the desert level. I'm thinking more and more about making a Mad Max like environment in LBP3 and Dreams. Oh, I have no doubt I'll be at home with sculpting pretty rapidly. I'm just not interested in watching it any more, unless they use new tools. As a member of this forum and an avid fan of the LBP community, I can say with certainty that the thing WE want to see the most at the moment is the tools and the logic. Can't you remember how we used to start planning our levels based on what we'd seen in LBP2/LBP3? That's what kept us ticking over as the launch neared and that's what made this forum and others so active. We are creative people and need to see how we can create. We still haven't seen the text tool, the transition options or the HUD options. We need to see those, not yet another sculpt. There WAS plenty to see here but did anyone really get a great kick out of seeing pumpkins being cut out? Be honest, the thing that got us excited was the skeleton horse, the dolls house, the horror game or the new spline based tool. | 2018-10-27 01:32:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| To be honest I really want to know how the text tools work and how skeleton rigs can be modified. I'm also wondering about more onscreen effects and how modifiable transitions can be. The stream was fun anyway. | 2018-10-27 04:15:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Yeh even though the sculpting looks quite fun to do yourself I've never really been interested in watching others do it. That's why my hype has only really started to build this past year or so as they've been showing more complex things. | 2018-10-28 15:43:00 Author: olit123  Posts: 1341 |
| https://i.imgur.com/7wioeJs.gif https://i.imgur.com/QpMcdc7.gif | 2018-10-29 01:33:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| How? Where??? Thanks for sharing | 2018-10-29 15:04:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| How? Where??? Thanks for sharing It's from a recent promo real but I'm waiting for a better version. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YoTKJKvByA | 2018-10-29 20:26:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| That tutorial gif slightly worries me as I was hoping for more interactive tutorials, like an option to pull up any related tutorials to a tool you're selecting (like LBP3's "advanced" mode, but instead of limiting options, just provide tooltips and links to tutorials that play in your level). What doesn't worry me is that there looks to be more than one tutorial set that is broken into small segments (Dreaming Basics, 1-12) As for what I took away from the stream is that a lot MM people are still saying beta this year, so I'm pretty hyped for a within the full year release As for sculpting, I definitely just walk away/skip ahead when Kareem comes on with his hour sculpts. I'll probably come back to it when Dreams is out, but it's very boring not knowing what buttons he's pressing and it's just long. | 2018-10-29 21:23:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| That tutorial gif slightly worries me as I was hoping for more interactive tutorials, like an option to pull up any related tutorials to a tool you're selecting (like LBP3's "advanced" mode, but instead of limiting options, just provide tooltips and links to tutorials that play in your level). What doesn't worry me is that there looks to be more than one tutorial set that is broken into small segments (Dreaming Basics, 1-12) As for what I took away from the stream is that a lot MM people are still saying beta this year, so I'm pretty hyped for a within the full year release As for sculpting, I definitely just walk away/skip ahead when Kareem comes on with his hour sculpts. I'll probably come back to it when Dreams is out, but it's very boring not knowing what buttons he's pressing and it's just long. I'm certain you'll be able to select the tutorial you need for any particular task. It wouldn't make sense not to be able to do that. If people are wondering why I'm not posting more Tweets, it's because I'm not currently getting any responses. I reckon I bothered them too much so I'm taking a break. LOL. | 2018-10-31 15:02:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Haha, looks like you asked them all. Or they are scared of you asking questions. To be honest so many questions make folks nervous, they feel like the FBI is asking them questions. Anyway, I think they're actually having some off time and preparing some stuff for the 10th anniversary stream. | 2018-10-31 19:37:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Some new concept art created in Dreams: https://vimeo.com/298242145 https://i.imgur.com/LfBridG.gif https://i.imgur.com/xzzgSvD.gif - - - - - - - - - - I was thinking about what Healey said concerning Dreams and their future projects. I am now absolutely positive that development teams are going to be formed around Dreams, and I'm not just talking in terms of the 'community', I'm talking about legitimate companies formed around Dreams as the development tool. As MM start creating their own games with Dreams, they're going to continue adding features and abilities necessary to realise their vision which in turn will also benefit us and any companies that are built using the Dreams development tool. This isn't a game, this isn't even just LBP+, this is a legitimate and professional suite of tools. THIS is why they've mentioned PSN and possible monetization in the future and THIS is why they haven't ruled out a possible PC adaptation. This isn't a 'toy', this is real Folks! We are about to step into a revolution and I find that exciting. | 2018-11-01 21:07:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I don't know if that will happen, but I wouldn't be too surprised if that happened. Developers could use Dreams and if monetization is approved by Sony it is the next big thing. It would also come to PS5, so it can be future proof. | 2018-11-03 08:52:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| This isn't a game, this isn't even just LBP+, this is a legitimate and professional suite of tools. THIS is why they've mentioned PSN and possible monetization in the future and THIS is why they haven't ruled out a possible PC adaptation. This isn't a 'toy', this is real Folks! Exactly what I been saying for some years now about Dreams! This has the possibility of being so much more then some mere amateur developer toy like LBP was. Dreams has the amazing balance of being both entertainment and a developer toolkit all wrapped up into one. And it would be a big waste if it was made in the exact same way as LBP where each game is made to only last a few years and left to be slowly forgotten afterwards… which is understandable that people leave it before to long as there was nothing to gain from creating in LBP outside of building some creative muscles for the creators… it was only hobby work and nothing more for the user creators in LBP… which is ok if one doesn’t want to aim higher in their life or make more professional content… but when a creator does want to go farther, then they quickly are forced to out grew LBP regardless if they wanted to or not from it’s far to many limitations. I think it’s hard for many LBP fans and gamers to accept the idea of creators being allowed to make money off of their hard work even as a mere “option” because it threatens their idea of a free utopia where nothing ever costs money with everybody making stuff just for fun n giggles, and some misguided fear that all the best creative works will be locked behind a paywall. Times may change, but many people’s self-entitlement and desire for free stuff never does. I think it would shock certain people to hear how much the average artist charges if you want to commission them for artworks… Even paying $60+ only for a basic single character artwork from a decently skilled artist is a fairly common and reasonable price honestly… with many higher end artists charging multiple 100s of dollars for the same kind of request. I’m gonna post this video below that goes into more detail on the subject of people demanding free creative works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X5fE0BuasM&feature=youtu.be Yes i'm aware this video is mainly about art, but I believe the concept works the same with most other kinds of creative works too. And just to say it before anybody worries, nobody should worry about absolutely “EVERYTHING” costing money no matter the result... because even popular artists for example still make art just for fun between work and upload that stuff for free often. The same can be said about any future creators in Dreams if a option existed to turn our projects into professional products. Point is creators will still make hobby work content for free even if they can make money too, it‘s just how most creative people work in general. I do hope we can import our Dreams projects onto PC and continue to work on them on there too if desired at some point, it really would greatly increase the life of our works! | 2018-11-03 16:21:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz  Posts: 4261 |
| It's a dream of many people to earn money by doing what they love. People want to be professional gamers, people want to be YouTubers, people want to be developers and what not. It sounds really exciting. I personally just feel like many people who started chasing their dreams and doing their hobby as a job get bored and burnt out, because they have to deliver content to survive, not because they had an idea. I've seen quite a few people who quit after some time. But I know a few people who are still doing what they love with much dedication. It's a personsal decision. Dreams itself won't have monetized games and options for people to just monetize their game. MM is going to figure that stuff out though and they want to use Dreams for future projects and from what I heard they want to offer Dreams like a engine for people to make games with it. Dreams is going to be PS4 exclusive. It is going to be available for PS5 at some point as well. There are no plans for a PC port or a PC companion app. And while the PC offers many advantages, I personally enjoy working on the PS4 platform in LBP3. | 2018-11-03 22:46:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| On the camera in the LBP level: https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1058848604545257473 | 2018-11-04 00:45:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I have no desire to see Dreams' games monetized, as it was never built for that. The engine seems to be built for much smaller pieces (though depending on how you can string them together this doesn't really mean anything) that I honestly wouldn't buy. Another reason I wouldn't want this project to be monetized (in it's current state) is that it would mean restricting access, and having to deal with royalties. Mm has a LOT of kid followers (they make family friendly games) all of whom would not be allowed to monetize their game (even this isn't consistent as different countries have different laws). For me, if one person isn't able to monetize their game in this (most likely) 60 dollar game, no one should be able to. I also very much admire the vision that Mm has with the free games. That being said, if Dreams was more feature rich (meaning getting nitty gritty with controlling EVERYTHING), then I could see it being marketed as an engine. Also, interesting about the multiplayer camera. I'm assuming that's like a gameplay camera in LBP as it clearly used a cinematic camera at the end of the LBP level. | 2018-11-04 00:46:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I have no desire to see Dreams' games monetized, as it was never built for that. The engine seems to be built for much smaller pieces (though depending on how you can string them together this doesn't really mean anything) that I honestly wouldn't buy. Another reason I wouldn't want this project to be monetized (in it's current state) is that it would mean restricting access, and having to deal with royalties. Mm has a LOT of kid followers (they make family friendly games) all of whom would not be allowed to monetize their game (even this isn't consistent as different countries have different laws). For me, if one person isn't able to monetize their game in this (most likely) 60 dollar game, no one should be able to. I also very much admire the vision that Mm has with the free games. That being said, if Dreams was more feature rich (meaning getting nitty gritty with controlling EVERYTHING), then I could see it being marketed as an engine. Also, interesting about the multiplayer camera. I'm assuming that's like a gameplay camera in LBP as it clearly used a cinematic camera at the end of the LBP level. It sounds to me as if they've got generic camera set ups you can choose in order to make like easier. Perhaps a side scrolling camera, a fully 3D camera and a isometric camera. That would cover most things. | 2018-11-04 06:11:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I have no desire to see Dreams' games monetized, as it was never built for that. The engine seems to be built for much smaller pieces (though depending on how you can string them together this doesn't really mean anything) that I honestly wouldn't buy. Another reason I wouldn't want this project to be monetized (in it's current state) is that it would mean restricting access, and having to deal with royalties. Mm has a LOT of kid followers (they make family friendly games) all of whom would not be allowed to monetize their game (even this isn't consistent as different countries have different laws). For me, if one person isn't able to monetize their game in this (most likely) 60 dollar game, no one should be able to. I also very much admire the vision that Mm has with the free games. That being said, if Dreams was more feature rich (meaning getting nitty gritty with controlling EVERYTHING), then I could see it being marketed as an engine. Also, interesting about the multiplayer camera. I'm assuming that's like a gameplay camera in LBP as it clearly used a cinematic camera at the end of the LBP level. They already talked about in the past that if they end up allowing other games made from Dreams to be sold that they would have to be sold separately outside of Dreams as their own standalone games. And who bloody cares if kids can't sell their projects too!? That's exactly how all game developing tools work just like how Unreal Engine 4 works... or how anything else in life goes for that matter. Why should adults suffer because of kids not being allowed the same things? There is no logic in that line of thought, like at all. And far as projects being to small.. just like you already said in your note, Dreams creators likely would be able to string together their level projects in a similar fashion to how it is on LBP3 with adventure maps already... plus as a note, if they allow it then even small projects should be allowed to be sold, Dreams would not only be used to make games... as movies and just plain art would exist too... And people do buy art as I said not long ago, so don't get me started there again. | 2018-11-04 07:42:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I have no desire to see Dreams' games monetized, as it was never built for that. The engine seems to be built for much smaller pieces (though depending on how you can string them together this doesn't really mean anything) that I honestly wouldn't buy. Another reason I wouldn't want this project to be monetized (in it's current state) is that it would mean restricting access, and having to deal with royalties. Mm has a LOT of kid followers (they make family friendly games) all of whom would not be allowed to monetize their game (even this isn't consistent as different countries have different laws). For me, if one person isn't able to monetize their game in this (most likely) 60 dollar game, no one should be able to. I also very much admire the vision that Mm has with the free games. That being said, if Dreams was more feature rich (meaning getting nitty gritty with controlling EVERYTHING), then I could see it being marketed as an engine. Also, interesting about the multiplayer camera. I'm assuming that's like a gameplay camera in LBP as it clearly used a cinematic camera at the end of the LBP level. MM talked about the idea. Allowing developers to use Dreams to make games that are sold outside of Dreams. | 2018-11-04 08:28:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I have a rather critical view on monetizing games like LBP or Dreams. To me its a contradiction to the "play-create-share" idea, which had made LBP so special! And which hopefully is also a basic idea of Dreams. I just try to imagine what kind of community we would have today if monetization would have been an option in LBP. I think that we would have more rivalry, we would have less helpfulness, I'm in doubt whether we would have a 10th anniversary at all. Just imagine you visit any creator on its moon and first you have to sign some convenants about the possible profitsharing or a waiver. I would foresee a lot of arguing and suspicion and a loss of the happiness and fun character, that made the LBP community and the forums great. Sure, really good creators spend a lot of hard work for their creations, thats a cool thing and I totally enjoy playing such levels! But thats part of the play-create-share idea, its always been part of it. You see, I'm no fan of monetizing ideas, I see levels or dreams with product placements and commercial breaks!...What a nightmare!! Puh! I woke up just in time! Many greetings, Jürgen^^ | 2018-11-04 13:14:00 Author: CuriousSack  Posts: 3981 |
| I have a rather critical view on monetizing games like LBP or Dreams. To me its a contradiction to the "play-create-share" idea, which had made LBP so special! And which hopefully is also a basic idea of Dreams. I just try to imagine what kind of community we would have today if monetization would have been an option in LBP. I think that we would have more rivalry, we would have less helpfulness, I'm in doubt whether we would have a 10th anniversary at all. Just imagine you visit any creator on its moon and first you have to sign some convenants about the possible profitsharing or a waiver. I would foresee a lot of arguing and suspicion and a loss of the happiness and fun character, that made the LBP community and the forums great. Sure, really good creators spend a lot of hard work for their creations, thats a cool thing and I totally enjoy playing such levels! But thats part of the play-create-share idea, its always been part of it. You see, I'm no fan of monetizing ideas, I see levels or dreams with product placements and commercial breaks!...What a nightmare!! Puh! I woke up just in time! Many greetings, Jürgen^^ Agreed. I'm a member of Resetera (nfortunately) and we've got a small but active Dreams community there. I've noticed the topics have frequently turned to remunerations, rights of ownership and a PC port. I've tried often to divert the conversation away from those topics because of the very things you've said here. I differ slightly in that I don't completely rule out the possibility for some time in the future. I just do not think building a good community is served well if mercenary thinking is centre stage right from the off. Give it a couple of years to embed the same dynamic we had in the LBP community and THEN consider these topics. | 2018-11-04 20:39:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Can you imagine playing a level in LBP or Dreams and only being able to play part of it and then a message comes, "To see the rest of this level, remit payment to Paypal" or something like that? Ridiculous. Anyway, something caught my ear in the Birthday stream on Friday. Alex was commenting on the LBP dreams creation and said there are no textures in Dreams. Wait, what? So, to create a brick, tree bark, wooden table, metal casing, I'll have to paint it to look that way? Did I understand that correctly? I don't like that at all, not one bit. | 2018-11-05 00:31:00 Author: biorogue  Posts: 8424 |
| Can you imagine playing a level in LBP or Dreams and only being able to play part of it and then a message comes, "To see the rest of this level, remit payment to Paypal" or something like that? Ridiculous. Anyway, something caught my ear in the Birthday stream on Friday. Alex was commenting on the LBP dreams creation and said there are no textures in Dreams. Wait, what? So, to create a brick, tree bark, wooden table, metal casing, I'll have to paint it to look that way? Did I understand that correctly? I don't like that at all, not one bit. Yes, you heard that right. There are no textures in Dreams. It's probably something you've overlooked or perhaps you haven't followed the development as closely as others? Just to clarify, that's not a criticism, that's an acknowledgement you may actually have a life beyond the internet! The engine Dreams is built upon uses splat technology and not your normal polygonal set up. When you load a level up, or anything anyone has created, you do not load in what they built, you download 'how they built it'. It literally reconstructs in real time what strokes, tools, manipulations you used to create the finished item. So, in order for it to add textures, it has to use exactly the same technique. This is actually a very important thing to bare in mind when building your levels or assets. Someone could make exactly the same thing you made but use less thermo or more thermo depending how they arrived at the finished result. For instance, if you were to create a town and built each building separately, the thermo would take each as a separate sculpt, however, if you were to take one sculpt and copy it hundreds of times, it would use up far less thermo because all it's doing is taking the 'process of construction' data and applying it with added 'location and orientation' data. You could spend hours building a spiral shape for a shell for instance. Everything you did to build that spiral would be stored. All the intricate sculpting and adjustments. If you took a square shape, spun it and then drew the shell, even though the finished result looks the same, it will cost less in terms of thermo. That's because it's simply adding the data you've 'spun' the square and then moved between point 'a' and 'b'. The detail it created isn't stored as data, the process of the method you created it is. I have a feeling we're going to get so many tips and tricks related to this. Just to add (and I was disappointed with this myself) the emit/destroy technique is of no use in Dreams. Anything you emit HAS to occupy space in the game and isn't stored elsewhere. Who knows, that may change in the future but right now that technique isn't a viable solution. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9KNtnCZDMI | 2018-11-05 01:37:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Wow, thanks a lot for this informative explanation! | 2018-11-05 03:49:00 Author: CuriousSack Posts: 3981 |
| Wow, thanks a lot for this informative explanation! Something I forgot to mention that also pertains to thermo use: If you take a complex shape and create another shape by mashing it together several times, Dreams automatically erases unnecessary edges and detail that are hidden 'within' the finished sculpt. To help visualise this, imagine a small square placed inside a larger square. Because the smaller square cannot be seen, Dreams dispenses with it. But note, it will only do that IF you select the finished item as ONE sculpt. If you don't then that small square still exists because Dreams can't assess whether you may want to use that hidden small square in some other way, such as sliding it out to create a raised platform. Basically, always remember to select the finished item as ONE sculpt in order for Dreams to calculate which edges/details it no longer needs to store as creation data. Going back to my original post, if you watch the Dreams streams you'll notice they always use the clone tool. Or they'll create a square with each side having a different design. That's because of what I said above. If you built something with squares and used 6 different designs for each, it would take up nearly 6 times the space of just building one square with a different design on each sides. They've been instilling in us the best way of designing levels without actually explaining why. It's pretty clever actually. | 2018-11-05 04:46:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| You see, I'm no fan of monetizing ideas, I see levels or dreams with product placements and commercial breaks!...What a nightmare!! Can you imagine playing a level in LBP or Dreams and only being able to play part of it and then a message comes, "To see the rest of this level, remit payment to Paypal" or something like that? Ridiculous. Holy mew you people can't think reasonably about this can you? Must it always be the worst-case scenario? Dreams itself wouldn't be monetized as the games/products made using it as a engine would be sold separately outside of Dreams leaving Dreams itself and it's community untouched. Maybe I could understand the outrage of the idea if the main Dreams game itself allowed monetizing, but that's not the concept here. I guess I should not be surprised that most gamers still can't be mature about this subject and continue to demand their "Free Utopia." Yes it does not impress me to hear people not even wanting others to have a "option " to make money and those people's hard work should be treated only like a toy... a joke basically. Look at it this way, If I told you guys that you should not be allowed to make money off of your actual jobs and or things you are very skilled at just because it ruins the idea of a free community, I can promise you that chat wouldn't go well and would make me look like a monster... as it should if I did that. And on another yet semi-related note. While I am not sure if MM will handle this any differently then LBP. There is also the fact if anybody in Dreams wanted to create a M rated game... such as "God Of War" ... they are super likely out of luck unless they can sell their games separately from Dreams... I REALLY doubt Dreams will have a mature games section, and i'm not saying the main game itself needs it whatsoever... But personally i'm not very interested in making games for children and never have been... and i'm sure many others feel the same even if not at the same degree as me. So realistically the only way I could see that being allowed is if we can make our games separate from Dreams itself only using Dreams as a ENGINE... otherwise we will be stuck with the same dull PG/10+ rating limit for are works as LBP. Maybe that sounds good to some people, but for others it's super limiting to their artistic expression... And that's not a good thing obviously unless you are a tyrant who believes in controlling others while only caring about your own interests. As a note I will say this. Even if we don't end up being allowed to sell our levels as games/movies/whatever later... Last I heard we already know MM at least will be allowing us to 3D print out our 3D models made in Dreams as I read that multiple times by them. And of course we can sell those 3D models on our own with whatever personal methods. Meaning there will already be ways to make at least some money off of our works in Dreams regardless! HAHA! Anyways as I'm sure many people here will keep disagreeing with me on the subject, furthermore as there is nothing else left for me to say on the matter without repeating myself. So to the delight of some I'm sure.... i am gonna go ahead and just drop the money subject for now. It's tiring, stressful and getting in the way of my work. Plus I don't really want to derail this topic farther either. | 2018-11-05 10:26:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I don't really see the money thing as derailing the conversation as it was definitely mentioned in a recent stream (though this isn't the thread for the stream, I don't think it really matters since it's more of a dreams news thread and every stream has more news. Plus the two threads would just keep intersecting). I do see your point (Lord-Dreamerz) about the amount of work put into dreams and wanting some reward out of it, but I always kind of get this "ech" feeling when that is mentioned simply because I think of Skyrim mods and RPG Maker. I'm gonna throw out Skyrim mods because your point of separate games null and voids that one. On the RPG maker example I'd say i've only liked about 3 games I've ever played from that and one was a pokemon fan game. Granted, Dreams has more creation tools than RPG Maker and is easier to just pick up and start. My main reason for me not wanting Dreams monetized is that based off of what I have seen, it's not a full engine. Now don't get me wrong, it does LOADS more than a lot of monetized engines out there (music creation, asset creation, etc); however, in regards to the game engine itself, it's lacking (no clear way to change how things are loaded (this might be untrue but everything they've said so far indicates this is the case), not that great of lighting and shadow effects, etc. Now realize as I say this game is lacking, I am actually VERY happy that these features are lacking as that is what makes this a game. It's like how java doesn't have you dealing with garbage collecting, but 20x more of an effect. Due to those reasons I'm a leaning no to no on my opinion. HOWEVER! Given one more iteration (a sequel) with monetizing and standalone games in mind, I do believe that Dreams would easily compete with unreal and unity. Phew. That was a long winded response. "I guess I should not be surprised that most gamers still can't be mature about this subject and continue to demand their 'Free Utopia.'" - I actually think that a lot of gamers are on the other side of the opinion spectrum than this site. I'd be surprised if LBPC were in the majority on this matter. As for the M rated content. I REALLY hope that MM doesn't moderate harshly if at all. I wish that there were some way to use the PS4 parental controls (giving instructions on game bootup) to filter levels automatically. I would love if people with out parental restrictions could submit tags/checklists of things the level included (blood/gore, nudity, drugs, language, etc.) so that the level author couldn't place it in the wrong category. This would keep the kids whose parents care (psh, overachievers ) out of bad levels and let others post what they want. Of course this summary of a system is underthought out, but hopefully something is in place! P.S. on a positive note on the moderation, they seem fine with violence, just maybe not loads of gore (like if you turned off blood in house of the dead (theyd probably actually be fine with green blood). This is coming from 2 streams, one where they built the gothic castle trap and more convincingly the Halloween stream where you got your head chopped off by a skeleton. | 2018-11-05 21:00:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I'm a bit disappointed with this. Swapping instruments: https://twitter.com/edhargrave/status/1059555378420219904 | 2018-11-05 22:04:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Wait, I'm confused. Why are you disappointed? I think Ed was replying in regards to what would sound good rather than just an example of switching instruments. His later reply answered you more directly. | 2018-11-05 22:18:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Wait, I'm confused. Why are you disappointed? I think Ed was replying in regards to what would sound good rather than just an example of switching instruments. His later reply answered you more directly. Yes, I just came to post the reply: https://twitter.com/edhargrave/status/1059569135418572800 | 2018-11-05 22:31:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Cool features, GribbleGrunger! Also, to Lord Dreamerz and koltonaugust: I personally think it's a good thing that MM considers to give some developers Dreams' engine to make games outside of Dreams itself to sell on the PS Store. I think it would also be a great idea to use the parental system on PS4 to determine what players (kids) can see and play in Dreams and to allow at least a little bit of nudity (like in The Witcher 3 for example), gore, strong language and things like that with tags that describe it. But Dreams will be like LBP. Family friendly. I guess extreme gore, strong language and things like that need to be left out in order to keep things family friendly. It's still a shame, because a few creators might want to feature serious topics like in Detroit Become Human or other games. We'll see what boundaries they set up and what kind of people get to use Dreams to make games outside of the community. Just a little bit of the money topic. I think you see it from a creator's perspective, Lord Dreamerz, but you also need to consider how players perceive it. LBP's DLC system wasn't that bad. You get some good content most of the time, but paid DLC always creates some borders. You can feel left out if you don't 'pay the premium' and it can scare people away. At least players. Creators like you and me would welcome the monetization option, but players would just feel left out I guess. That's why they are scared of such a system and prefer a 'outside of Dreams' option. | 2018-11-06 11:15:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I've got to say, really looking forward to what MM is coming up with. Honestly, this is why I was skeptical about MM giving the LBP franchise to Sumo-Digital. Sumo just didn't have the heart/spirit that the LBP creators had when making the first 2 games. Although I still love LBP3, and the game is still going strong, it was ultimate MM who created my favorite childhood memories (LBP1 AND LBP2). MM has heart and passion. And I really look forward to whatever else they plan to do after they release Dreams. | 2018-11-06 15:45:00 Author: gurren009  Posts: 2592 |
| While there are certain limitations with Dreams I think it's still going to be a big hit for me. Unity Engine is cool and I'm using it, but it doesn't offer sound creation, modelling, easy to learn but complex logic system and many more things in one package. You have to trade in money making, adult takes on a theme and limitation to PS4, but it's still worth it. | 2018-11-06 17:48:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| On the RPG maker example I'd say i've only liked about 3 games I've ever played from that and one was a pokemon fan game. If you haven't already seen it, try out the sold version of the game "OneShot" , it is one of my favorite RPG Maker games and is a game I love in general. As for the M rated content. I REALLY hope that MM doesn't moderate harshly if at all. I wish that there were some way to use the PS4 parental controls (giving instructions on game bootup) to filter levels automatically. I would love if people with out parental restrictions could submit tags/checklists of things the level included (blood/gore, nudity, drugs, language, etc.) so that the level author couldn't place it in the wrong category. This would keep the kids whose parents care (psh, overachievers ) out of bad levels and let others post what they want. Of course this summary of a system is underthought out, but hopefully something is in place!P.S. on a positive note on the moderation, they seem fine with violence, just maybe not loads of gore (like if you turned off blood in house of the dead (theyd probably actually be fine with green blood). This is coming from 2 streams, one where they built the gothic castle trap and more convincingly the Halloween stream where you got your head chopped off by a skeleton. That is assuming MM has a choice in the matter as I would guess Sony is the one who ultimately will or won't put their foot down on the subject and forcing MM to bend to their will. I learn to not trust most game companies on properly allowing adult content often, especially when it comes to non-super realistic style games, for example there is lots of anime style games that get censored in the western markets by many game companies and sometimes even the game's age rating gets lowered afterwards just so the game can be sold to a supposedly broader audience... We are now lucky that Steam just recently allows adult games, because for awhile they technically didn't allow it and were removing stuff such as adult anime dating sims at the time. You say MM did some light adult content in levels on a stream... while that is nice to hear, but MM might be able to get away with more then the users... just a thought. It would be great if MM allowed adult content in Dreams as-long there is a method to not allow kids to get to it easily... however I do think it's unrealistic to expect that to happen, and still feel it's a better bet of being able to separate our games from Dreams so that it would work easier for that stuff. As a note: I personally am not relying on Dreams to make my personal games as I am a PC game developer and been training myself mostly in that area nowadays. However Dreams still looks great fun to create in, more so then stuff like Unreal or Unity on PC. I don't feel Dreams is to limited to be used as a game engine... especially as you said it's already far more advance then something simple like RPG Maker which is a thing people still used today to make games. I don't think one needs complete freedom with their tools in order to make professional games if they are fine with it. But I can't be bothered to spend more years of my life learning how to make higher quality games on yet another game making engine if that content is trapped on a single console game itself that might die someday and everything is lost forever among some other reasons. I tend to mainly work on only bigger personal game projects as a note. Hobby work is all good and fine, but now if I can help it, I prefer to invest in things that I can take farther with me in life when it comes to my creative works as there is only so much time to share it between other things. On another note. It was cool seeing small part of LBP remade in Dreams! Looked very close to the original... Almost makes one wonder if there would even be a point in Sony making a LBP4 anymore because we could almost make a LBP4 in Dreams! Haha! But neh... I still think there is a place for a LBP4 as one can never get the full LBP experience from Dreams outside of some small novelty levels. And I still feel a LBP4 would be best left 2.5D for it's core gameplay and not try to compete with Dreams and it's far less limited nature. There's still a place for LBP I feel, it just need to stick to being it's own flavor of concept. | 2018-11-06 18:24:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I think I remember someone from MM mentioning you can use "assets" you create in Dreams in other game programs. I always assumed it might be limited to visual and musical content, though, it doesn't "seem" impossible to expand that to animations, visual effects, programming (i.e. turning logic into programmable code?), etc. (this, of course, coming from a guy with novice video game programming experience) On the topic of monetization, this may be an unpopular opinion, but I actually kind of like the idea of, say, running an ad before or after one plays a level, as long as its not too intrusive or disruptive, and was completely optional...and maybe was limited to specific levels chosen by MM as being "worthy of sitting through a thirty-second ad to play"? Games of any type or scale take a lot of time and energy to create...It would certainly give creators more incentive to to create higher quality levels if it meant they could make a little money off them?  I dunno...Just something to think about. | 2018-11-07 00:26:00 Author: comishguy67 Posts: 849 |
| Huh, I weirdly agree with everyone even though everyone is saying pretty different things. @GribbleGrunger - Keep those twitter questions coming XD! I'm loving them! @mdkd - I actually think Dreams is the least family friendly game that Mm has done in a LONG time. I mean, just from the trailer everyone thought that Art was getting out of a coffin (the guitar case). Also the color schemes are definitely on the darker noire film era side which can be scary to kids. I do think Lord Dreamerz is right though about Mm probably not having the final say in whats allowed. One can still hope for very little moderation with a great level discovery system (which will be IMPRESSIVE if they pull off both). @gurren - I also feel that Mm is really what made me love LBP, not LBP itself. When I first played LBP1, I actually HATED it since I'm not a big fan of 2D platformers. I didn't at the time realize there were creation tools or the developers just put their heart into the work and once I found that out I fell in love with it. @Lord-Dreamerz - I feel that about wanting to invest your time in things that give you something back. That's why I'm actually hoping dreams gets a sequel that is just a full fledged engine, geared toward standalone experiences and not bound to one console. However, I'm fine with dreams for a while @comishguy - That is a really neat idea (as long as the ads are optional)! I wouldn't expect much from the exporting of assets since there are no meshes really to export (though I have no idea what 3d printers take to work so maybe they do have a voxel to mesh converter, though then I'd wonder what kind of mesh as different programs save them differently. Though i suppose some programs work with voxel sculpting similarly to dreams, but I honestly don't have much knowledge here.). I'm expecting audio, 3d print files, and probably one more thing that I'm overlooking to be allowed to be exported. Maybe a midi file? | 2018-11-07 07:01:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Any questions you lot would like asking? Nothing we know they're not likely to answer. | 2018-11-07 08:43:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Keep in mind, Dreams will go for 60$. You pay for the story, the toolkit and the potential community levels. Seeing ads in a 60$ game is not what you want. Some straight monetization is much better. Make your game outside of Dreams and sell it with a license for selling things. This is coming from a creator of big projects, but also from a player who enjoys the LBP spirit. Anyway, if it wasn't asked, can you ask how custom fonts work? Do you design them like any object or specifically as font? | 2018-11-07 10:26:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Keep in mind, Dreams will go for 60$. You pay for the story, the toolkit and the potential community levels. Seeing ads in a 60$ game is not what you want. Some straight monetization is much better. Make your game outside of Dreams and sell it with a license for selling things. This is coming from a creator of big projects, but also from a player who enjoys the LBP spirit. Anyway, if it wasn't asked, can you ask how custom fonts work? Do you design them like any object or specifically as font? I've got to go out for a couple of hours. I think I know who to ask about this so I'll do it when I get back. | 2018-11-07 10:41:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| It would be so cool if we could import our own fonts like with audio. | 2018-11-07 13:27:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341 |
| Still no reply. Either they're crunching or got fed up of may constant questioning. | 2018-11-07 22:16:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| According to one of the videos, they don't crunch at Mm, but they are undoubtedly busy before the beta announcement. I'm curious as to what their last minute fixes before beta are as there haven't been many apparent changes in the past few streams. My guess is online stuff and UI for menus. I would say I'd be surprised if online worked super well during the beta, but honestly at this point they've surprised me so many times (in good ways) that I'm numb to more features. It's like that feeling after thanksgiving dinner. Also, I don't think Mm is fed up with any questions. I think they're super excited about them, but are unsure of how much they are allowed to say. | 2018-11-07 22:47:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| On fonts. Unfortunately he didn't fully understand what I meant. I've added another post explaining more carefully but he hasn't answered that: https://twitter.com/Gribblegrunger/status/1060155672258662400 | 2018-11-08 14:12:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I have not been following Dreams news much. I have question of which I have no idea if MM talked about it before. How organic can we make characters in Dreams? Most characters I've seen from Dreams are very clay model or toy in looks... while that is not a huge problem, but it would be nice to know how far we can go on the style of our characters. And on a somewhat related note, I still wonder if MM will have cross promotion DLC with other game series like LBP did... for example imagine a Sonic The hedgehog DLC level pack in Dreams with premade Sonic characters and objects for users. While we could technically make stuff like that ourselves in Dreams... but I could still see MM doing it regardless, which might be interesting. Maybe DLC content would somehow be little more advance then what we can make in Dreams depending on how limited things are... As just a idea they might even directly import the character models from their own games to this one. | 2018-11-08 14:31:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I have not been following Dreams news much. I have question of which I have no idea if MM talked about it before. How organic can we make characters in Dreams? Most characters I've seen from Dreams are very clay model or toy in looks... while that is not a huge problem, but it would be nice to know how far we can go on the style of our characters. And on a somewhat related note, I still wonder if MM will have cross promotion DLC with other game series like LBP did... for example imagine a Sonic The hedgehog DLC level pack in Dreams with premade Sonic characters and objects for users. While we could technically make stuff like that ourselves in Dreams... but I could still see MM doing it regardless, which might be interesting. Maybe DLC content would somehow be little more advance then what we can make in Dreams depending on how limited things are... As just a idea they might even directly import the character models from their own games to this one. There are many ways to make your characters. The first choice is clearly going to be the mannequin, which has plenty of flexibility, but then you have traditional methods using keyframe animation, such as the horse in the recent Halloween stream, and animations created by swapping between assets, which has the advantage of being able to create 'drawn' animations using the 'strokes' tool. Here's the horse created using keyframe animation. Bare in mind he threw this together for the Halloween stream and given days instead of hours, he could have cleaned this up greatly: https://youtu.be/qIkN2IvWEj0?t=1h13m36s On the subject of the bolded: They won't do that. Everything in Dreams HAS to be made in Dreams. That is the rule they're following. This is a serious development tool and they're going to treat it as such moving forward, even going as far as making their next game with it. | 2018-11-08 15:16:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| There are many ways to make your characters. The first choice is clearly going to be the mannequin, which has plenty of flexibility, but then you have traditional methods using keyframe animation, such as the horse in the recent Halloween stream, and animations created by swapping between assets, which has the advantage of being able to create 'drawn' animations using the 'strokes' tool. Here's the horse created using keyframe animation. Bare in mind he threw this together for the Halloween stream and given days instead of hours, he could have cleaned this up greatly: https://youtu.be/qIkN2IvWEj0?t=1h13m36s That doesn't really answer my question. That horse is very Non-organic and still follows under the whole toy look including visible separated joints on it's limbs. | 2018-11-08 15:24:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| That doesn't really answer my question. That horse is very Non-organic and still follows under the whole toy look including visible separated joints on it's limbs. That's just the style he chose. Given more time and a different style, you could easily make something that didn't look so non-organic. At the end of the day though, Dreams isn't going to compete with the likes of the ND or GG engine, it's going to allow people to make AA titles comparable to top notch Indie games or less realistic looking AAA titles such as Tearaway. | 2018-11-08 15:28:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| it's going to allow people to make AA titles comparable to top notch Indie games I'm not sure what that is suppose to mean exactly considering 3D indie games can have any level of 3D graphics using the same tools PS4 games are made with and beyond. Would help if there was examples of humanoid characters I could see... only ones i've really seen much is that detective guy and bear girl from the storymode trailers which are very clearly toy style. | 2018-11-08 15:40:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I'm not sure what that is suppose to mean exactly considering 3D indie games can have any level of 3D graphics using the same tools PS4 games are made with and beyond. Would help if there was examples of humanoid characters I could see... only ones i've really seen much is that detective guy and bear girl from the storymode trailers which are very clearly toy style. You are in control of building, designing, animating, shading, texturing etc. You can't use that knowledge to extrapolate the potential for something other than MMs style? | 2018-11-08 15:51:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| You are in control of building, designing, animating, shading, texturing etc. You can't use that knowledge to extrapolate the potential for something other than MMs style? I don't get what you are trying to get at? I was just curious how far the character creation could go visually including if it could go beyond a toy style as that is mainly what has been shown, and wanted to see examples. I can't sit here and assume we can easily go beyond MM's own styles if I have no evidence for it... sure we likely will be able to do more advance things then they have shown... but to what end is still a mystery, and there is no reason we should assume anything. | 2018-11-08 16:04:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| I don't get what you are trying to get at? I was just curious how far the character creation could go visually including if it could go beyond a toy style as that is mainly what has been shown, and wanted to see examples. I can't sit here and assume we can easily go beyond MM's own styles if I have no evidence for it... sure we likely will be able to do more advance things then they have shown... but to what end is still a mystery, and there is no reason we should assume anything. Of course you can. Some people are going to go well beyond anything MM have done themselves. It's just art style, approach and method. | 2018-11-08 16:13:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| I think you meant to ask if there are other styles for characters, right? MM chose the 'sketchy' appearance like in a notebook and a little bit like in Tearaway for most of their projects, but the LBP anniversary stream looked a little bit different. Although there aren't any textures to choose from, The guy behind the anniversary level managed to make the bricks look like bricks and the wood like wood. I think in theory other artstyles for characters are possible, we just need to see how much the style can differ. | 2018-11-08 19:06:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I think you meant to ask if there are other styles for characters, right? MM chose the 'sketchy' appearance like in a notebook and a little bit like in Tearaway for most of their projects, but the LBP anniversary stream looked a little bit different. Although there aren't any textures to choose from, The guy behind the anniversary level managed to make the bricks look like bricks and the wood like wood. I think in theory other artstyles for characters are possible, we just need to see how much the style can differ. It's not 'in theory', it's definitely. Art style is infinite even within the confines of particular mediums. Even something as basic as a pencil has infinite possibilities. https://www.google.co.uk/search?safe=off&hl=en&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1536&bih=755&ei=HtnkW54VxIJqgvKsoAY&q=pencil+drawing&oq=pencil+&gs_l=img.1.0.0l10.2281.7393.0.9294.16.10.4.2.3.0.8 5.631.9.9.0....0...1ac.1.64.img..1.15.681.0..0i10k 1j0i5i30k1j0i24k1j0i10i24k1.0.xBYxn55pCf8 | 2018-11-09 00:46:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Even something as basic as a pencil has infinite possibilities. Near infinite possibilities, sure... And yet a black pencil on white paper still can't do colors by itself nor can it do exactly the same kind of brushstrokes a paintbrush does. It's still limited in what it can do just like Dreams will probably be to some degree. LBP also technically had infinite possibilities on what we could make in it, but it also was super limited in exactly how it could make stuff which is why Dreams is exciting by comparison. You could had just told me that you didn't know how far Dreams could be taken and we'll have to wait to see. But anyways I now know at least it's still a case of we'll have to wait until the community gets their hands on it to see the possibilities of the tools, as MM hasn't really shown us non-toy/clay model style characters yet from the sounds of it. | 2018-11-09 14:06:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261 |
| Near infinite possibilities, sure... And yet a black pencil on white paper still can't do colors by itself nor can it do exactly the same kind of brushstrokes a paintbrush does. It's still limited in what it can do just like Dreams will probably be to some degree. LBP also technically had infinite possibilities on what we could make in it, but it also was super limited in exactly how it could make stuff which is why Dreams is exciting by comparison. You could had just told me that you didn't know how far Dreams could be taken and we'll have to wait to see. But anyways I now know at least it's still a case of we'll have to wait until the community gets their hands on it to see the possibilities of the tools, as MM hasn't really shown us non-toy/clay model style characters yet from the sounds of it. Ok, I'm not certain we're talking about the same thing. Just give me a couple of examples of what you mean so I can better understand. When you say 'beyond toy style' what exactly do you mean? | 2018-11-09 23:54:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Oh, I have a question for you to twitter GribbleGrunger! Will there be a similar site to LBP.me or a way to queue dreams outside of the game? As for the animation bits, there have been 3 streams that show "new" things about how dreams handle animation. 1. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/327643720 At 01:16:45 they show keyframes for the skeleton horse, but they don't really show how you interact/set them. Personally I hate the horses walking animation, but don't mind the running animation. 2. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/289478196 At 01:01:24 they show the character walking. This is probably the least toy model version they ever show, but it's still very action figurey. Don't know if this is just because they had to do it within an hour. 3. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/241602333 At 00:25:02 They show the basic animation using mannequins and tweak settings. Smaller one: 4.https://www.twitch.tv/videos/75426996 At 00:49:13 there is a nice moving astronaut though it seems like its the lbp style where they're oddly anchored only at torso to the global z axis. To answer your question in short Lord-Dreamerz, no, they have not shown anything regarding animations besides basic techniques. The halloween stream is the first time i had ever seen the keyframes shown. I honestly can't tell you if there are possibilities beyond the clay modeling style as they haven't really shown that many tweaks to the materials but have mentioned things (color, opacity, shine) that could be of use to stray from that style. From what I've seen, clay and cell-shaded will be the easiest styles to pull off. Edit: Weird, right after I posted this I realized Mm recently posted a job posting on facebook (today) "Come work at Media Molecule! We have several open positions right now, including a Javascript Developer to help bring #DreamsPS4 to life on the web! https://www.mediamolecule.com/jobs" | 2018-11-10 04:19:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| On rotating with the dualshock: https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1061194231765762048 https://twitter.com/monsterplant/status/1061197458531860480 On something similar to LBP.me: https://twitter.com/marcoshealey/status/1061183933617000449 On Dream surfing: https://twitter.com/Peter__Field/status/1061153096737476608 | 2018-11-10 10:04:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Yay! Super glad to hear about the dreams.me or whatever! That Dream surfing answer was a bit confusing, but it seems trivial compared to other features. It sounds like he's saying yes, but I can't tell if he's saying yes to dreamsurfing options or yes to a play a random dream or yes to temporarily stopping the surfing to finish a dream. | 2018-11-10 12:51:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Yay! Super glad to hear about the dreams.me or whatever! That Dream surfing answer was a bit confusing, but it seems trivial compared to other features. It sounds like he's saying yes, but I can't tell if he's saying yes to dreamsurfing options or yes to a play a random dream or yes to temporarily stopping the surfing to finish a dream. Yeah, I found it hard to convey what I meant in such a short amount of words. We know when you Dream surf it splices 3 games together, taking a chapter from one and then a chapter from another and then a chapter from the third before returning to the first again. I don't want to do that because it would break up any atmosphere a creator has put effort into. I want to Dream surf but play each FULL game before automatically moving onto the next. I know you can click on individual games but that takes the randomness (and surprise) out of it a little. - - - - - - - - - - Near infinite possibilities, sure... And yet a black pencil on white paper still can't do colors by itself nor can it do exactly the same kind of brushstrokes a paintbrush does. It's still limited in what it can do just like Dreams will probably be to some degree. LBP also technically had infinite possibilities on what we could make in it, but it also was super limited in exactly how it could make stuff which is why Dreams is exciting by comparison. You could had just told me that you didn't know how far Dreams could be taken and we'll have to wait to see. But anyways I now know at least it's still a case of we'll have to wait until the community gets their hands on it to see the possibilities of the tools, as MM hasn't really shown us non-toy/clay model style characters yet from the sounds of it. Listen from 25:36. That should answer your question I think: https://www.gameinformer.com/video-podcast/the-game-informer-show/2018/10/29/answering-dreams-lingering-questions | 2018-11-10 13:52:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| On something similar to LBP.me, I came across this a month or so ago. https://indreams.me/ | 2018-11-10 13:52:00 Author: biorogue Posts: 8424 |
| That's interesting, bio. Looks like that could be Dreams' site for levels and communities. I heard they wanted to provide a better site to interact with people outside of the game. | 2018-11-10 13:57:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| On something similar to LBP.me, I came across this a month or so ago. https://indreams.me/ I actually remember seeing that on Resetera. LOL. I forgot ... | 2018-11-10 14:15:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Someone brought up monetization and while on the phone last night with a bud, we laughed our butts off to the thought of lp10’s copied shark levels bombarding the psn store ������ | 2018-11-10 18:08:00 Author: L-I-M-I  Posts: 611 |
| Fingers crossed: https://twitter.com/Johnee_B/status/1061546113650565122 | 2018-11-11 14:18:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Someone brought up monetization and while on the phone last night with a bud, we laughed our butts off to the thought of lp10’s copied shark levels bombarding the psn store ������ Haha, no, not these kinds of levels. We meant serious games created in Dreams that could go for 5 bucks or something. | 2018-11-12 01:30:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| More Questions: Is there a way to organize levels that you want to play later, or is it reserved to just a queue and favorites as in LBP? In regards to the genealogy on objects, is there a way to see the credits for a level? Maybe even percentages of creators objects used in the level? Even further in that regard, can you see the percentages of types of objects? For example say I REALLY like the music in a level, and I want to find the creator of that music, can I find out that 70% of the music is created by, say, mdkd99, 20% by the author, and 10% by, oh look, me? | 2018-11-13 13:33:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| More Questions: Is there a way to organize levels that you want to play later, or is it reserved to just a queue and favorites as in LBP? In regards to the genealogy on objects, is there a way to see the credits for a level? Maybe even percentages of creators objects used in the level? Even further in that regard, can you see the percentages of types of objects? For example say I REALLY like the music in a level, and I want to find the creator of that music, can I find out that 70% of the music is created by, say, mdkd99, 20% by the author, and 10% by, oh look, me? He's onto me, folks! Jokes aside though, I don't think it works like that, it's much simpler. Like 'Contributions: Also made by mdkd99 and Koltonaugust'. I'd need to ask though. In LBP3 you can create multiple playlists and add levels to it. Maybe that's how it works in Dreams too. | 2018-11-13 18:11:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Mmmm ... It's gone quiet again and I still haven't got any replies from three MM staff members I asked questions of. I don't really want to bother them too much but I really would like to see these two photo realistic pics they spoke about. Hopefully John gets back to me. | 2018-11-13 19:44:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| More Questions: Is there a way to organize levels that you want to play later, or is it reserved to just a queue and favorites as in LBP? In regards to the genealogy on objects, is there a way to see the credits for a level? Maybe even percentages of creators objects used in the level? Even further in that regard, can you see the percentages of types of objects? For example say I REALLY like the music in a level, and I want to find the creator of that music, can I find out that 70% of the music is created by, say, mdkd99, 20% by the author, and 10% by, oh look, me? Sounds pretty complex, maybe a QoL thing they could add down the line. | 2018-11-13 22:58:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341 |
| I'd also like to see those screensaver pictures. Photorealistic is a cool thing. And if it can be achieved in Dreams that would be cool. | 2018-11-14 04:01:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Sounds pretty complex, maybe a QoL thing they could add down the line. Oh I agree, but I do think the first one they probably have. Or at least they probably have playlists which wouldn't be so bad in LBP3 if they didn't freeze the game to load EVERY SINGLE PERSON'S earth when scrolling through levels. The second one would just even further encourage sharing, and based off of Kareem's talk, doesn't sound far off from what they've explained. Def not necessary though | 2018-11-14 07:22:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| I'm going out on a limb here. I've been waiting for three replies from different MM employees and still nothing. It seems to me that they've gone dark for a while which could mean they're working hard to get ready for something ... I'm expecting the beta soon! | 2018-11-14 19:02:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| Camp on social media to be the first to sign up for the Beta. How big will the Beta be, what do you think? | 2018-11-14 19:54:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Camp on social media to be the first to sign up for the Beta. How big will the Beta be, what do you think? In my opinion, it will be open but in waves, starting with the better potential the LBP creators offer and then filtering down to Joe Blogs. I also think it'll be more like 'early access' (minus the campaign) than a beta and run through to launch. | 2018-11-14 19:59:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910 |
| File size? What do you think? | 2018-11-15 01:34:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I think it's going to surprise us with how small it is. Considering they say things are loaded as edits, i'd be surprised if its 20GB | 2018-11-15 06:28:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Keep in mind, Dreams will go for 60$. You pay for the story, the toolkit and the potential community levels. Seeing ads in a 60$ game is not what you want. Some straight monetization is much better. Make your game outside of Dreams and sell it with a license for selling things. This is coming from a creator of big projects, but also from a player who enjoys the LBP spirit. Yeah, I could see people feeling a bit cheated about watching an ad in a game they've already paid for! XD I felt ads might be a compromise between paying creators for their work yet not excluding players who haven't purchased their content from those who have (like the DLCs in LBP!). Ah well... I can certainly see Dreams being one's primary asset-creation tool for games IRL (considering how horrible I am with digital art, I might be one of them XD). | 2018-11-15 15:30:00 Author: comishguy67 Posts: 849 |
| While we don't have the snail screensaver, I found this floating around from years ago which is a happy medium imo https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4804/45849269152_ee375cdc2a_o.jpg | 2018-11-15 23:17:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Very nice, still got that signature dreams look though, but I like that you can identify it as Dreams honestly. | 2018-11-19 19:09:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341 |
| Very nice, still got that signature dreams look though, but I like that you can identify it as Dreams honestly. I really like that too. I think this was before the Made in Dreams marketing started, but not too far before it. | 2018-11-19 20:48:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Oh it definitely looks like something MM made with Dreams. | 2018-11-20 13:27:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| Dreams is definitely not a 60 dollar game. The campaign and the user-creating content is easily enough to be the cost of a current-generation videogame console. Its only 60 bucks because of that being the modern cost of games, as well as not everyone being able to pull out a hundred bucks from their pockets. | 2018-11-21 16:49:00 Author: gurren009 Posts: 2592 |
| 60 bucks is the industry standard. It is much more worth than 60 bucks. I agree there. | 2018-11-22 15:11:00 Author: mdkd99 Posts: 1172 |
| I believe I found what they were referring to. https://twitter.com/mediamolecule/status/859748223191220227 It's a pretty good recreation of the photo, but definitely not photorealistic. Comparison: https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4827/44210868840_e8537ceb66_o.jpg https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4904/45976804832_2662cf5342_o.jpg | 2018-11-24 12:38:00 Author: koltonaugust Posts: 1382 |
| Looks lovely, wouldn't be surprised if that much detail used up all the budget though lol | 2018-11-24 14:59:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341 |
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