Archive: 18 posts

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I've discovered, to my dismay, that the last level I published (VR Shooting Gallery) has a major issue. Many of the targets do not add to the "targets hit" count that helps to calculate the bonus at the end. To summarize the logic, I used tags. Each time a target is destroyed, it briefly activates a tag labeled "enemy". There's a tag sensor on the HUD that picks up these tags, and affects the bonus accordingly (at this point, it is wired). All the targets use identical logic for this purpose. Since the only tags going off are ones that you shoot, distance is not an issue. Several locations have multiple identical targets. Some work, some don't. At one spot, I even deleted the one that didn't work, copied one that did. It still doesn't work. Only thing I can think of is that I do have ALOT of tags in this level, and yes, most are the same color, only different names. I tried making this particular set of tags/sensors a different color; the exact same ones still failed. Hard wiring each and every target is not an option; some of the targets are emitted. I've made some changes, and have gotten most of these targets to work (moved the logic from the target itself and onto a chip in the room itself). But it makes no sense to me that logic that worked half way thru making the level no longer works, or that identical logic works in one part of the level, but not another. I also found another issue, with the final boss. I have 5 score givers, in descending value, connected via an AND gate each, to a selector switch. Each time the boss manages to fire at you, the selector switch cycles down one. When you destroy it, it activates the other input of all 5 and gates. Thus, you get points based on the current position of the selector switch. Playing this recently, I discovered that for some reason (and it doesn't do this in create mode at all), it automatically cycles thru and gives you the points each and every time. And I have no idea why. Has anybody else had frustration logic problems like this? It's making me want to scrap the idea of making innovative level, and start making shark/bomb/zombie levels (well, not really).

2011-12-27 22:33:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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'different names' if this is the case... you need a seperate sensor for each colour / name combo, you mention 'There's a tag sensor on the hud'... this will only pick up 1 named tag (and colour) so in effect neglecting your other tags regards Dave

2011-12-28 00:34:00 Author: ForgottenEnigma Posts: 1414

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When I say "different names" I meant for different tasks. All the targets have the same green "enemy" tag for said purpose. When I remove the wired logic from the tag (making it active) the sensor picks it up, confirming that they do match. All the targets use identical logic for this purpose. It's just that some of them work and some don't. Some that worked half way through making the level, suddenly no longer work. Also, several areas with identical targets have mixed results.

2011-12-28 00:50:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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ah ok, um well.. i'm not too sure, I'll have a think about it and possibly get back to you later (if no one else replies that is)

2011-12-28 01:18:00 Author: ForgottenEnigma Posts: 1414

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do you have the tag activating at the same time as the destroyer? or is there a delay on the destroyer? or are 2 targets being hit at the same time? also posting a pick of the logic on both ends would help us identify any issue

2011-12-28 02:03:00 Author: evret Posts: 612

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The tags are in fact activated at the same time as the destroyer, but it works perfectly the first half of the level. Is it possible for identical logic to behave different at different times? I tried not to add the delay, but I'll try it and see if it helps any (as soon as my wife gets off the Wii).

2011-12-28 02:41:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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If the level is more complex it certain areas it can cause it to fail in those areas. You can use a 3 port selector to add a one frame delay on the destroyer. have the current state at 1, wire the hit logic to input 2, wire output 2 to input 3 and wire output 3 to your destroyer.

2011-12-28 04:09:00 Author: evret Posts: 612

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also, how are you dealing with multiple signals at the same time? Logically speaking; What happens if you shoot more than one thing at the same time?

2011-12-28 07:24:00 Author: Mr_Fusion Posts: 1799

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also, how are you dealing with multiple signals at the same time? Logically speaking; What happens if you shoot more than one thing at the same time? i assumed thats not an issue as he didnt say anything about it when I asked the same question.

2011-12-28 07:45:00 Author: evret Posts: 612

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bah! you did... thats what happens when you're reading on an iPhone, I managed to read the first part of your question not the second. Which is funny, because I thought it was strange that you didn't seem to ask... considering that you have the perfect event buffer.

2011-12-28 08:27:00 Author: Mr_Fusion Posts: 1799

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I actually realised this early on, and took great pains to ensure that the player couldn't hit 2 targets at the same time, or at least rarely. That's also why in rooms with multiple targets that shoot at you, they shoot in a staggered fashion.

2011-12-28 11:03:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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have you been able to try delaying the destroyer yet? also as fusion mentioned, you can use an event buffer to make sure all hits are counted, even if more than one is hit at the same time. this is made even easier if you are using feedback loops for health and/or to count kills

2011-12-28 11:25:00 Author: evret Posts: 612

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also as fusion mentioned, you can use an event buffer to make sure all hits are counted, even if more than one is hit at the same time. this is made even easier if you are using feedback loops for health and/or to count kills I would not necessarily call it easier. It might make the most sense when you can bend your head around them, which I am still trying. @OP: meanwhile, a digital buffering solution can be found in a tutorial linked in my signature. The comments over there give great additional insights and progress into the analog buffer evret mentioned. Know in advance: you want to be absolutely sure that you have checked that delayed destroyer first, set your tag colors and names correctly before deciding there is a need for a buffer system that tracks consecutive occurences of a flashing tag. Trying to save you time.

2011-12-28 16:20:00 Author: Antikris Posts: 1340

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I'll try to do it the easy way, but I definitely bookmarked your tutorial for future study. I should be able to get on tonight and try a few fixes.

2011-12-28 22:30:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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The 3-port selector switch delay did the trick. Thanks!!!! Now I just have a few other minor issues to fix, and I might be able to republish tonight.

2011-12-29 19:25:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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Hum, yeah, a 3-port selector does the job. I prefer doing it with 0.1 sec timers, but I guess it makes more sense using selectors. Hum, I hadn't thought about this, but yeah, I should replace this in the next version of my health meter toolkit. And add a selector-based delay switch. In fact, I don't know why I didn't think about it before. Perhaps I did but decided it took space on the chip while a timer looks more clean ? Or perhaps I did it with a timer and realized it later... And decided to be lazy ^^ If you still have trouble, there's already a working system in my health meter toolkit which works with multiple hits together, but you seem to be fine. (and yet another ad for my kit - I like the help forum )

2011-12-29 22:56:00 Author: Unknown User

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Everything seems to be working good now, and has been republished.

2011-12-30 00:38:00 Author: Brannayen Posts: 438

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Hum, yeah, a 3-port selector does the job. I prefer doing it with 0.1 sec timers, but I guess it makes more sense using selectors. Hum, I hadn't thought about this, but yeah, I should replace this in the next version of my health meter toolkit. And add a selector-based delay switch. In fact, I don't know why I didn't think about it before. Perhaps I did but decided it took space on the chip while a timer looks more clean ? Or perhaps I did it with a timer and realized it later... And decided to be lazy ^^ If you still have trouble, there's already a working system in my health meter toolkit which works with multiple hits together, but you seem to be fine. (and yet another ad for my kit - I like the help forum ) the selector method allows you to add a one frame delay, and u can add a frame easily just by extending the selector. the timer method has a min delay of 0.1 secs (3 frames) i always use a timer if if i need a delay over 0.1 though, coz as you said it is neater

2011-12-30 10:06:00 Author: evret Posts: 612

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