Archive: 15 posts

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i've noticed that my style of creating eats up thermo mainly because i like detail. i will be using my infinite thermo trick a lot in the next level but i want to also use a destroyer to also help that thermo. here's the thing though: how do you create a level that uses that technique? would you set up the section you will eventually destroy and then when you want to create the next section, destroy it before you carry on creating? or would you just continue until the thermo is nearly full and then destroy it. obviously it would be set up differently in play mode, but i'm just wondering how people get around the whole tinkering problem. i noticed that in my first level i was often going back and changing things but surely that would make it really difficult to do if you need to constantly emit the first section (or the second, third, etc) just to make fine adjustment

2011-11-13 05:40:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910

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The tinkering problem is pretty much something you have to live with. If you need to change one of the emitted level chunks, you have to place the saved object, edit it, create a new saved object, and adjust your emitter to use the new piece. Naturally, if the emitter is on another emitted chunk... The best thing you can do is plan ahead to minimize the amount of chunk loading you'll need. Make sure you have plenty of backups: everything is rigged to destroy itself and that could get ugly! Destroying a section of the level and emitting another one is easy, it's just a matter of having the patience to get it all built.

2011-11-13 06:47:00 Author: Uncuddly Posts: 237

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You can keep each chunk in a separate level, and "pack"all in the emitters and copy to the target level when you have the final versions. This brings you annoying switching from level to level, but prevents from random errors that occur in dealing with frequent emitting and saving in the emitter, and does not "disturb" thermo of the main level.

2011-11-13 08:00:00 Author: goranilic Posts: 332

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yep, that's what I'd do. select a large crater, clear it out, and build in segments. Then just assemble them in your final level. However, instead of placing them into emitters to move them from the segment level, I would capture the entire segment then place it in the level and capture that into the emitter during positioning/final tweaks. Then capture it into a final object and place that in the emitter when it is done. That way you don't have to constantly edit, recapture, and place in the emitter.

2011-11-13 09:48:00 Author: tdarb Posts: 689

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christ though, if you create them in different sections as if they were different levels and then brought them together you'd need exact measurements or it would be hellish to get them to line up. i wouldn't want the transition to be crude: drop down long hole, enter emitted section. i'd want it to feel as natural as it could be. if only the whole level could be divided into sectors! edit: wouldn't a compromise between the two modes of thinking be better here. what if you made three simplified parts with little detail and one material only? you then set up the emitters to match them and emit in the final build. you then put each in its separate level and tinker with the materials and detail? you could also have sections that join the emitted sections suspended by antigavs. another question: if you emit partly over something, do you lose what you emit over or a part of what you emit?

2011-11-13 10:30:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910

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You can't emit something into a place where something else exists. Like anything in LBP, there are tons of ways to approach the same thing. A few thing: No need to have crude transitions like falling down a deep hole. You can have a large jump,, just big enough that sackboy can't jump back up. In most cases, a spawn portal should be there, so, if they die or pop, they won't go back to the destroyed area. Be inventive, the cave could collapse behind them if its part of the story or theme. Now, you can destroy the previous area, and they can't go back. To line up created sections, use your grid, that way, they will line up evenly. If you are managing really large sections, setting up the emitters can be troublesome since the camera may not focus on the area you want line up. In those cases, get a friend to be a "spotter". Building large set pieces in separate levels has one major advantage, when capturing large set pieces, it can be difficult to capture without capturing random pieces of other things in there. Lastly, a method I've developed is to build a large set piece, and, if there are no moving pieces - piece one large piece of holo over the entire set piece, glue it to the piece. Put a destroyer (set to include all rigid connections) on the holo with a tag sensor set to a 5,000 radius. Name it "Kill Section 2" or something. On your next section, when the player gets to the point where they can't return to section 2, have a player sensor hooked up to a tag name the same thing. Now, when the player triggers the tag, the entire piece of section 2 will simply disappear. However, my biggest piece of advice, only use this method if you must. It's very time consuming and has the potential to get confusing and hectic. Proceed with caution. Good luck.

2011-11-13 16:55:00 Author: CYMBOL Posts: 1230

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Rather than approaching the level as a series of distinct chunks with transitions between them, you can also envision the project as more of a giant conveyor belt. If you make Chunk 1 and Chunk 2 small enough to exist at the same time, you can simply allow the player to walk into Chunk 2 without any fancy business. Once the player is in the middle of Chunk 2 and unable to see either end of it, you delete Chunk 1 and emit Chunk 3. As long as you're sneaky enough to prevent the player from observing what you're doing on the edges of a chunk the smoothness of the presentation is assured! I'll second the "good luck" sentiment. It's an ambitious project any way you slice it!

2011-11-13 17:07:00 Author: Uncuddly Posts: 237

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I'll go ahead and ask here instead of making my own topic. do you have to place destroyers on every single thing? my levels i make have tons of moving bits & Deco on holo that are not glued on to the level parts themselves. and it'd take me ages to go back and add destroyers on to everything i made and emitted. sense i don't add emit and destroy level parts until I have made a lot of the level. *mew

2011-11-13 17:08:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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An individual destroyer can only remove stuff that is connected to it, so every loose object and wandering sackbot will need to be deleted separately. If you have a group of bots you might lethalize the floor to kill them with a minimal number of destroyers, but it's still going to be a fair amount of work rigging everything to self-destruct.

2011-11-13 17:25:00 Author: Uncuddly Posts: 237

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bots would just die from the gas i always put around my level, so that's never a problem. i was hoping making a big block of holo with destroyer on it would destroy everything in it if i made the holo sticky but sadly holo can't be made sticky. really wish it be more easy to destroy big areas... ohwell. *mew

2011-11-13 17:34:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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I'll go ahead and ask here instead of making my own topic. do you have to place destroyers on every single thing? my levels i make have tons of moving bits & Deco on holo that are not glued on to the level parts themselves. and it'd take me ages to go back and add destroyers on to everything i made and emitted. sense i don't add emit and destroy level parts until I have made a lot of the level. *mew You can use my holo method (read above) to destroy the large section, but yes, you need to destroy the smaller bits individually. I suggest just having a chip with the same tag sensor and destroyer on your emitted pieces in that section. That way, when the tag is triggered not only does the large section get destroyed, but anything else that you've deemed related to that section by placing the chip on it will disappear as well. That's what i would do, but I'm sure others have different suggestions, and probably better ones too.

2011-11-13 17:35:00 Author: CYMBOL Posts: 1230

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You can use my holo method (read above) to destroy the large section, but yes, you need to destroy the smaller bits individually. I suggest just having a chip with the same tag sensor and destroyer on your emitted pieces in that section. That way, when the tag is triggered not only does the large section get destroyed, but anything else that you've deemed related to that section by placing the chip on it will disappear as well. That's what i would do, but I'm sure others have different suggestions, and probably better ones too. to me, that sounds the perfect solution. this is definitely the route i'll go if i start running out of thermo. it's so simple. all you have to do is try and add in certain situation where the player can't return and then later, if you are low on thermo (and losing materials lol) you can just pop some holo over it all and destroy as you said. i never thought of this and it just makes so much sense. on the holo workaround, could you use a impact sensor to line them up? could that be used as a visual indication for those sections that get difficult to place because of size? thanks once again CYMBOL and all of you other lovely creators

2011-11-13 18:14:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910

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Yeah, I've done the holo indicator to help line things up, but sometimes, you'll have a really large piece, and the camera won't focus on that area. Like I said, in those cases, just get a friend to spot you.

2011-11-13 19:50:00 Author: CYMBOL Posts: 1230

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Yeah, I really hate that holo can't be sticky. I had so many ideas that didn't work because of bad holo behavior. 1) Custom grapple hook made with a holo-follower you had to grab. It was for a contest, I couldn't use sackbots. Problem is the player couldn't be pulled by a moving block of holo because player is heavier than holo. 2) Appearing wheel which can be grabbed by player to spin and throw himself away. Not working because 100% anti-gravity tweaks on a grab-able holo block makes the arm stretch glitch since again, holo has no weight. 3) Ship moving by pointing in a way and shooting a holo block that had a follower on it and that would get glued in the ship, so the whole ship would move the way you shot. Didn't work 'cause holo can't be sticky. 4) HUD with a face showing how player is happy. Didn't work cause holo is too blurry and transparent. 5) Destroying massive amounts of objects with a piece of holo. That's why holo isn't my favorite material. I prefer light matter.

2011-11-13 23:59:00 Author: Unknown User

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yeah, that's pretty much why i suggested that sticker panel material should have a physics setting so that you could do all of what you have suggested and also some neat animated platforming

2011-11-14 02:00:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910

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