Archive: 71 posts

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If we already paid for the console and the game, isn't that enough? We paid for the game to get the game! Sony has enough money to giveaway dlc for free! It make no sense to me! I paid for the game to get the whole game!

2011-06-21 22:23:00 Author: Unknown User

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Money makes the world go round. Well, that and gravity. The gaming industry has come a long way since Pong. Games cost nearly as much to make now as a mega-blockbuster movie, sometimes costing tens of millions of dollars, and with the entire production cycle lasting three to five years to develop. Game companies hire and employ dozens, sometimes over a hundred high-tech, very smart (and well-compensated) people to create and design these games for you. In addition, there's trademarks, intellectual property, merchandising, advertising, production, manufacturing, audience testing, and any number of other related activities that turn their game into a smooth, profit-generating machine that can satisfy the needs of shareholders. DLC is but one key of the gaming market, designed specifically and solely for the purpose of enticing you to buy more of a specific product in order to extend the lifetime of the game, keep you playing, and most of all, bring in revenue. Simply put, DLC costs money to produce, and therefore is not free.

2011-06-21 22:30:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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Why do you have to buy the DLC? Did you buy LBP2 and felt like there was something missing? Something you ought to have gotten for your initial purchase? When you bought LBP2 it was not 80% finished, it was 100% finished. A company's goal is to make money. There is no reason for a company to give away free stuff unless they believe it will deliver them more money in the long run. In communist Russia DLC buys you.

2011-06-21 22:35:00 Author: Antikris Posts: 1340

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Free DLC is considered an update, and those only happen when people that use game-breaking glitches cry because their profile got corrupted.

2011-06-22 05:50:00 Author: nunsmasher Posts: 247

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The amount of time that this game has entertained me would break down to about 50cents an hour. And I have pretty much purchased all of the DLC. Cheapest form of entertainment out there if you think about it that way.

2011-06-22 07:40:00 Author: Mr_Fusion Posts: 1799

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The amount of time that this game has entertained me would break down to about 50cents an hour. And I have pretty much purchased all of the DLC. Cheapest form of entertainment out there if you think about it that way. Cable TV account cancelled - CHECK World of Warcraft account cancelled - CHECK PS3, LBP1, LBP2 and most non-costume DLC acquired - CHECK

2011-06-22 09:49:00 Author: Antikris Posts: 1340

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The amount of time that this game has entertained me would break down to about 50cents an hour. And I have pretty much purchased all of the DLC. Cheapest form of entertainment out there if you think about it that way. Exactly my thoughts too. When you buy a game, it sure costs a lot of money on the buy, but then, you realize it's not a lot when you consider the time you play, whereas you could go to an attraction park, where'd you ride 3 or 4 rides (Like me, who hates rollercoasters, but hey, I'm not going to private my friends and family during a trip !) and it costs you 50 bucks too for a day. When I bought NHL11 (3615 mylife), I spent 60$ and thought it was a lot. However, the amount of time I spend on this game is really worth it, I probably passed 200 hours on it since I have it. Plus, DLC is just a bonus, not obligated. It's like the fast past in attraction parks : You pay for the entry, and you have to pay more to get that bonus and have more fun. That's how it works.

2011-06-22 14:49:00 Author: Unknown User

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Actually, the DLC structure of this game is very nice. MM has been very clever and gentle with their DLC methods, they let people without the DLC's play the DLC based community levels, so you don't have to acquire the MGS pack to play a level that is made of MGS materials. It was the logical thing to do, but you know game company's are not always logical!

2011-06-22 15:03:00 Author: hesido Posts: 166

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I partly share your attitude, if you wrote this with the upcoming Move DLC in mind. The box says 'Playstation Move Features'. And it doesn't have any just now but they're gonna add if via paid DLC a year later? Eh, doesn't fly with me, MM. The extra features with the pack? Hell yeah I'll pay for. But base functionality shouldn't be extra. At least, I think you need the DLC to use the Move in the levels. If not, then I take this back. However, in all other circumstances, I must agree with the other posters. If you don't want to pay for the extra content, don't. Easy. Problem solved. Myself, and many others are glad to see continuing support for the game. DLC rocks! But extra content, costs extra money. And, what's more, I dunno if anyone will agree with me, but I've always felt MM was always extremely fair with their prices. Imagine if Activision owned LBP. ?10 costume packs, anyone?

2011-06-22 15:07:00 Author: Ostler5000 Posts: 1017

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I have easily spent hundreds of hours in create mode just having a blast making my ideas come to life. That alone is worth the price of the game. The DLC helps me to better the process. I am willing to pay for that.

2011-06-22 15:15:00 Author: poorjack Posts: 1806

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I think you need the DLC to use the Move in the levels. If not, then I take this back.? You need the Pack to create with Move. Playing Move-levels is free and you don't need the DLC pack for it. *mew

2011-06-22 15:25:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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You need the Pack to create with Move. Playing Move-levels is free and you don't need the DLC pack for it. *mew Ah, wonderful. In which case, the paid Move DLC is just fine. Don't mind paying for tools. But base-functionality would, indeed, blow.

2011-06-22 15:35:00 Author: Ostler5000 Posts: 1017

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I partly share your attitude, if you wrote this with the upcoming Move DLC in mind. The box says 'Playstation Move Features'. And it doesn't. I think they meant Sackboy's Prehistoric Moves (included on the disc) with the Move label. Sneaky of them

2011-06-22 18:25:00 Author: Radishlord Posts: 706

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I think they meant Sackboy's Prehistoric Moves (included on the disc) with the Move label. Sneaky of them I thought about that aswell. I really hope that wasn't their game. Seems a bit... cheap.

2011-06-22 18:40:00 Author: Ostler5000 Posts: 1017

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Apart from the previously mentioned production cost of the DLC there's also the cost of running the servers that they'll be helping to offset and there's alot of content from 3rd parties that'll want payment, Ubisoft, Capcom, Disney etc aren't going to let their IP be used for free.

2011-06-22 19:47:00 Author: Rabid-Coot Posts: 6728

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If we already paid for the console and the game, isn't that enough? We paid for the game to get the game! Sony has enough money to giveaway dlc for free! It make no sense to me! I paid for the game to get the whole game! you don't HAVE to pay for DLC. LBP is designed to grow over time... how can you complain when it does just that? i have no DLC at the moment and nor am i connected to the net (this is a friends PC) but my mind boggles at the possibilities that present themselves with the game as it stands alone. i WILL be buying DLC in the near future, but i don't see it as a negative, i see it as a positive. get over yourself with this for goodness sake

2011-06-22 19:51:00 Author: GribbleGrunger Posts: 3910

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A topic where the OP says something then never returns... I don't say this often, but I think they were a troll o:

2011-06-22 21:27:00 Author: Bernkastel Posts: 127

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A topic where the OP says something then never returns... I don't say this often, but I think they were a troll o: 23 hour absense = Never coming back? In any case, this isn't a rare complaint. Lots of people don't take kindly to the idea of DLC.

2011-06-22 21:32:00 Author: Ostler5000 Posts: 1017

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While I don't mind paying for DLC and I understand the reasons why you have to pay for it, I hate it when developers release DLC for a game the same day it launches. I understand that development for a game is generally over long before the game actually comes out and the developer obviously comes up with new ideas in that time, but at least wait a couple months/weeks and let me enjoy the game a little before tying to get more money from me!

2011-06-22 22:35:00 Author: KnutsoPX Posts: 116

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While I don't mind paying for DLC and I understand the reasons why you have to pay for it, I hate it when developers release DLC for a game the same day it launches. I understand that development for a game is generally over long before the game actually comes out and the developer obviously comes up with new ideas in that time, but at least wait a couple months/weeks and let me enjoy the game a little before tying to get more money from me! They had to release DLC on the first week because people were awaiting the Week 1 T-Shirt

2011-06-22 22:42:00 Author: Retro Posts: 104

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I skipped most the posts... If you look at how long youve played lbp2 and compare that to the cost... You have profited off buying it...

2011-06-22 22:44:00 Author: BonBonBoi Posts: 246

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They had to release DLC on the first week because people were awaiting the Week 1 T-Shirt I wasn't necessarily talking about LBP2. I love this game and Mm can do whatever they want in my opinion

2011-06-22 22:53:00 Author: KnutsoPX Posts: 116

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23 hour absense = Never coming back? In any case, this isn't a rare complaint. Lots of people don't take kindly to the idea of DLC. Well, DLC exists primarily to prevent you, the consumer, from selling your copy of the game back to a store like Gamestop. See, publishers (Activision, for instance) don't make any money on used game sales, so it's in their interest to prevent consumers from reselling their copies. That's why it gets a bad rap - people view DLC as a piece of the game that should have been included with the initial purchase, not an additional piece of content that was developed after the game released. The reality is actually pretty muddy. Oftentimes, DLC is actually developed after the fact, and could not have been included with the original game. For example, see (almost) any DLC released by Bethesda for Oblivion or Fallout 3. However, it's also common for developers to develop DLC alongside the game (Call of Duty map packs), or even strip out small chunks of the game and offer it as DLC later (pre-order bonuses, anyone?). As a consumer, it's hard to tell the difference between content developed "with" your $60 and content developed "after" you bought the game, so DLC is generally seen as a cash grab. In LBP/LBP2's case, there's a lot of both. Media Molecule tends to be responsible for the bigger DLC, while the smaller stuff is made by other supporting dev studios. Costumes and other similar content are cheap to produce and attract a lot of revenue, so while they are, in some cases, not worth the asking price, the fact that people buy them means they're not going anywhere. The meatier stuff - levels, create packs, music packs, etc - tends to make less money because it's aimed at Creators (a smaller group), but because they have that additional pillar of financial support (costumes, etc), they can justify spending time on the bigger stuff even if it doesn't make obscene amounts of money on its own. Basically, what it comes down to is this: vote with your dollar. This is a business, and money is a necessity. By supporting the content you like (and not supporting the content you don't), you teach publishers and developers what consumers prefer and ensure more of it will be produced in the future.

2011-06-22 22:59:00 Author: ConfusedCartman Posts: 3729

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I can't help it, if I can use it in create, I tend to buy it. Not only that, but I'm always looking for more. I can't blame them for selling me things I want. Although, I am disappointed at the lack of decorations in many packs. I don't need any more stickers. More decs please!

2011-06-22 23:25:00 Author: CYMBOL Posts: 1230

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DLC is actually this generation console invention and i don't think is so much key element of industry, because game can survive without it. Before that on PC there was expansions, other then that everything was free.

2011-06-22 23:37:00 Author: Shadowriver Posts: 3991

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I think DLC is both good and bad, depending on which DLC we're talking about. Pre-order in-game benefits, petty extras that are ultimately meaningless like maps, skins, powers, etc, stuff that actually was in the game but got cut out (AC2's main DLC's for example) that might as well be included in it? To hell with that. That's the very example of greedy, bad DLC's. At the very least, they should come cheap (like LBP's 0.99? individual costumes) and available to all, not with a code you only get by ordering the limited Special Collector's Golden-Diamond Bling Bling Edition of the game at some specific retailer. Packs like the MGS Paintinator pack, Dragon Age: Awakening, Borderlands: The Armory of General Knoxx and RDR: Undead Nightmare? Those are good DLC's. Fair price, and they actually expand the experience besides just adding new stuff. That's the kind of DLC every developer should make. Look at Minecraft. Notch dares not to release an update that increases the game's version number without including new gameplay elements for free like tameable wolves, trapdoors, and even a whole new playable dimension. I remember a time when a decent game would come full of thoughtful bonuses like artwork galleries, "Behind the Scenes" videos, New Game+ skins, demos of games that'd be released soon. Now which of those treats do we get when we buy our games, more expensive than ever? In how many games in the recent years did you spot an "Extras" section in the main menu? Not in many, I bet. The character skins are now pre-order bonuses. The artwork and behind the scenes material now come in the form of books and DVD's with special editions. You'll get demos and access to betas if you buy at Best Buy, Amazon or Gamestop. And do you know why virtually every game publisher now dreams of sucking their clients' money with DLC's even before their games hit the market? Because there are people sheepish enough to buy these petty DLC's from them. It's a fad that'll only die once players stop wasting 15 bucks for half a dozen of multiplayer maps they'll barely even play.

2011-06-23 00:59:00 Author: SnipySev Posts: 2452

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if you buy some DLC and the download was like.. 50KB, you got ripped off.

2011-06-23 03:11:00 Author: Bernkastel Posts: 127

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They had to release DLC on the first week because people were awaiting the Week 1 T-Shirt I have had ALL 3 LBP realeases on DAY ONE... And never got the week one shirt because I am a forgetful bear.

2011-06-23 04:00:00 Author: poorjack Posts: 1806

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Why do you have to buy the DLC? Did you buy LBP2 and felt like there was something missing? Something you ought to have gotten for your initial purchase? When you bought LBP2 it was not 80% finished, it was 100% finished. A company's goal is to make money. There is no reason for a company to give away free stuff unless they believe it will deliver them more money in the long run. In communist Russia DLC buys you. It's Soviet Russia, by the way. I personally think DLC is cool. It adds heaps more stuff to do in the game, and extends it's life.

2011-06-23 09:39:00 Author: BeaversLikeWood Posts: 119

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if you buy some DLC and the download was like.. 50KB, you got ripped off. Except in the case of some DLC, in which the download merely activates stuff that was downloaded in a patch. Such is the case with LBP.

2011-06-23 13:54:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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To be fair have give a lot away, the last new one was Mariachi and you dont have to own DLC to play any level with the new stuff on so

2011-06-23 14:17:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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if you buy some DLC and the download was like.. 50KB, you got ripped off. Game have DLC data for runtime use from a patches, so you can play levels with it and play with friends with it without any interference. Good side of it that you got limited access to that DLC, bad side is yea.... it fills little like rip off

2011-06-23 14:33:00 Author: Shadowriver Posts: 3991

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I remember a time when a decent game would come full of thoughtful bonuses like artwork galleries, "Behind the Scenes" videos, New Game+ skins, demos of games that'd be released soon. Correct me if I'm mistaken, but that was the same time that games shipped and then support for the game (in almost 100% of titles on consoles at least) was 0. As consumers we now expect ongoing support for games we buy as a given and this includes free patches and updates and all that jazz. So it's swings and roundabouts... Yes, companies want to monetise their long-term support with paid-for DLC, if they didn't, then you could pretty much kiss goodbye all of the free support as well in most cases. It's not a coincidence that many of the best-supported (in terms of continual improvement) games are also the ones that you keep on paying into.

2011-06-23 18:11:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I look at DLC, at least in the form of costumes, like movie collectables. Star Wars action figures and the like.. or coffee mugs and glasses. I don't need them, but if I like it enough I might buy it. For the most part the costumes are pretty cheap. I have quite a few of them, but not nearly all of them. ..now DLC that gives me more stickers, music, sound, or new game play mechanics like MGS or Water etc? I am all over those.

2011-06-23 18:22:00 Author: jwwphotos Posts: 11383

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Game have DLC data for runtime use from a patches, so you can play levels with it and play with friends with it without any interference. Good side of it that you got limited access to that DLC, bad side is yea.... it fills little like rip off ah, I meant for new games, not ones with real DLC systems set up (like LBP)

2011-06-24 04:37:00 Author: Bernkastel Posts: 127

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ah, I meant for new games, not ones with real DLC systems set up (like LBP) Then why post in everything else LBP2? and not in a general gaming chat?

2011-06-24 04:56:00 Author: poorjack Posts: 1806

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I think they meant Sackboy's Prehistoric Moves (included on the disc) with the Move label. Sneaky of them If you noticed I thunk they had Move plaed from the beginning, As it's labels on the disc. Also have any of you seen a video on YouTube "A day at Mm Studios" where it showcases what there doing on day one of LBP2? Spaff shows us to some people who are "Working On Some new DLC" (P.S They're holding a PlayStation Move) LBP Has been built on the concept of DLC, in an effort to keep our minds creating.

2011-06-24 07:09:00 Author: BeaversLikeWood Posts: 119

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The box is definitly refering to Prehistoric Moves, it says Includes 10 bonus playstation move co-op levels. http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/81dmdKlnJSL._AA1500_.jpg

2011-06-24 09:57:00 Author: Rabid-Coot Posts: 6728

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Oh what? so now we're expected to read things and pay attention before we get all stroppy about stuff? Pft.

2011-06-24 10:16:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Oh what? so now we're expected to read things and pay attention before we get all stroppy about stuff? Pft. Exactly!!! It's my right as a consumer to mis-read something, and then get all stroppy when it turns out to not be what I thought it was! Although... they did maintain a "move compatible" status in a sneaky way with Prehistoric Moves. They could have made much more of an effort to explain that Move controls would 'not' be included in the full game - but why would they do that - when they can stick a "move-compatible" sticker on it and trust that people don't read the fine-print And companies are removing content from the final release - for it then to be released as DLC within the release window of the game. Traditionally - this kind of content would be included in the release title - or at the very least would be unlockable as bonus content. Now they are giving us a release titles only 80/90% complete, and expect us to "upgrade" with DLC the other 10/20% of the game. It's naked profiteering - nothing else.

2011-06-24 11:33:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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If game companies decided to put all the content that would've been DLC before they relase the game, it would be a disaster. Games would take at least twice as long to make, and the initial release price for the game would be through the roof. Would you rather have a game made in 2 years at $50, with loads of extra content made over time that you have the option of buying Or a 4 year game at $100 that had all the content that would've been DLC made throughout the games life?

2011-06-24 17:46:00 Author: JKthree Posts: 1125

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If you were a millionaire would you give away money to everyone that asked because you had enough? I doubt it because eventually you'd run out of money. It's the same scenario here. Remember the people at MM are still getting paid as well so they need to make money somehow. Either with DLC or a new game.

2011-06-24 19:38:00 Author: ADS_LEGEND Posts: 140

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Money makes the world go round. Well, that and gravity. :kz:Nuuuuuuuuu....Rotators do that.

2011-06-25 22:23:00 Author: IronSkullKid99 Posts: 515

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There's nothing wrong with them wanting to make money. It's a business and you can choose whether or not you even want to buy it. Also, LBP DLC is all pretty reasonably priced. It's not like you'd be getting ripped off or anything. It's better than the TF2 store lol

2011-06-26 16:35:00 Author: Sack-Jake Posts: 1153

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Correct me if I'm mistaken, but that was the same time that games shipped and then support for the game (in almost 100% of titles on consoles at least) was 0. As consumers we now expect ongoing support for games we buy as a given and this includes free patches and updates and all that jazz. So it's swings and roundabouts... Yes, companies want to monetise their long-term support with paid-for DLC, if they didn't, then you could pretty much kiss goodbye all of the free support as well in most cases. It's not a coincidence that many of the best-supported (in terms of continual improvement) games are also the ones that you keep on paying into. Good point, but I didn't say all DLC was uncalled for. I just drew a line between good and bad DLC. If they're going to make DLC, make it worthwhile and make the price fair. I'm happy to give 9.99? for Undead Nightmare or 5.99 for the the MGS level pack. Those are thoughtful DLC's, worth paying over. But stripping features from the game and selling them separately? Please. I won't contribute for some CEO's coin pool, not when his favourite hobby is trying to find new ways to get money from me with the least effort possible.

2011-06-28 14:24:00 Author: SnipySev Posts: 2452

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If you buy a new car, and you want some extras, you have to buy them. extras cost time and thus money to make. just like the DLC they are extras and optional. And have this is mind, how more money MM will get how more awesome stuff WE get

2011-06-28 20:53:00 Author: Dexist Posts: 570

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I can't seem to land comfortably on just one side of the DLC debate, but in the case of LBP+LBP2, buying the full game and expecting to receive free DLC forever is like buying a 100 crayon box set and expecting to receive new crayons after that -- new crayons that didn't exist at the time you bought the box. Buying a car does not entitle you to constant and free add-ons just because the industry keeps making them after your purchase. You don't buy a DVD box set and become entitled to future content that isn't yet created. And you don't buy a dozen eggs at the store expecting to get another free egg every day just because "the chicken KNEW it was going to be laying more eggs, that's not fair!" Except... those are bad examples, because we are frequently sold on the promise of free future upgrades to cars. DVDs literally do come packaged with access to future media. And eggs are a whole different thing, because they're perishable goods with a five thousand year sales history -- the materials in LBP+LBP2 are not perishable, and digital markets are new. I completely understand the DLC model, and I utterly hate it in some cases. But ultimately, just like crayons, cars, DVDs and eggs by the dozen, we know the way the business works when we buy a video game. The onus is on the consumer to shop smart, and wait for deals to come along. LBP+LBP2 have never promised free content, just more content. Nobody has been betrayed. Mm has been great. However, not relating to LBP+LBP2, I also have a general fear of DLC because it seems to be a hybrid of past models that are deformed from legal abuse, more commonly seen in hidden subscription fees and royalty and copyright claims. If we become conditioned to pay full price for entertainment that's really more like a monthly installment service, companies far less honest and reputable than Mm will exploit that. This is what has veteran gamers up in arms, even when DLC is done "right". LBP+LBP2 is done "right" and I am endlessly pleased. I have bought a lot of DLC. It's a mixed feeling. It seems the OP is not a veteran gamer, or at any rate comes off sounding a bit entitled. Kind of makes all this balanced discussion a bit moot. I really hope he wasn't trolling, but I doubt he started the thread so we could all change his mind. UPDATE: Just saw Dexist's post above mine, he's very succinct with his car example! Thumbs up!

2011-06-29 05:17:00 Author: Unknown User

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Two words: "Horse Armour (http://www.develop-online.net/news/32395/Industry-needs-to-get-around-horse-armor-strategies)"

2011-06-29 10:07:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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I don't think the week 1 shirt came out in AUS for LBP1 or LBP2... sad face. DLC like this is also a way to prevent scummy practices of some games stores. You buy the game and there is a one off redemption/unlock of content that is already on the disc. It stops the discussion with the person who walks into the store and tries to buy the game only to have the pushy sales staff offer a traded in two week old copy for $5 less... but I want that horse armour! The reason this is scummy it's $5 less to you but 100% profit for the store as they don't need to kick any money back up to the developers. So in a way it is actually an exorbitant mark up, DLC is used to protect where the money ends up. EDIT: As for this being a troll... well what are they gonna do? Log back in and go: HAHAH! You guys are having a logical debate about what you feel right about considering a worthy DLC purchase. lolololoolol? When I was a kid a troll was: 'Spock could kick Han Solo's butt any day of the week'.

2011-06-29 10:41:00 Author: Mr_Fusion Posts: 1799

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Also, certainly from my own habits/perspective... When I buy DLC, I will use pre-paid cards. Now how can it be, that it is cheaper for me to buy a pre-paid game card from somewhere like Play.com - and then them ship a package from the Isle of Wight to where I live in Scotland - including in courier costs and packaging/printing/manufacture of the pre-paid cards... than it is to just add money to my account directly - no shipping, no packaging etc - from the online store? and it's a good 10% cheaper aswell? Can anyone explain that?

2011-06-29 10:47:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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The reason this is scummy it's $5 less to you but 100% profit for the store as they don't need to kick any money back up to the developers. But the trade-in wasn't free either (though I have no idea what a trade-in goes for, I expect the profit is still larger than a new copy). When I was a kid a troll was sitting under a bridge letting small billy goats pass only to get thrown off the bridge by the biggest goat.

2011-06-29 11:10:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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Also, certainly from my own habits/perspective... When I buy DLC, I will use pre-paid cards. Now how can it be, that it is cheaper for me to buy a pre-paid game card from somewhere like Play.com - and then them ship a package from the Isle of Wight to where I live in Scotland - including in courier costs and packaging/printing/manufacture of the pre-paid cards... than it is to just add money to my account directly - no shipping, no packaging etc - from the online store? and it's a good 10% cheaper aswell? Can anyone explain that? Play will be buying their prepaid cards for less than the face value and cutting into their profits to attrat customers.

2011-06-29 12:08:00 Author: Rabid-Coot Posts: 6728

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Play will be buying their prepaid cards for less than the face value and cutting into their profits to attract customers. Right - but prepaid cards at "less than face value" are not available to your average consumer - it's obviously a supply deal from Sony; Sony will sell "cut-price" cards to Play.com, providing that Play buy a certain amount of stock from them. But I still don't see how it's cheaper for Sony to do this kind of deal - when they could cut out the middle man altogether - and just sell their games cheaper from their own store directly to the consumer? It might make sense to an economist - but it doesn't make sense in the real world. Especially as stuff like this is contributing to global over-consumption (of the plastic the pre-paid cards are made from, of the cardboard packaging they are delivered in, and of the fuel it takes to deliver them)

2011-06-29 13:18:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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They did cut out the middle man at the start, it took a few years before cards got started. I'd speculate they exist to capture the market that can't or won't enter their details on the PSN which would have been kids originally but after recent events will probably be alot more people.

2011-06-29 13:56:00 Author: Rabid-Coot Posts: 6728

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Well, if I have a choice between paying ?20 for ?20's worth of content (wether it's actually worth the ?20 is a different debate) - or ?18 for ?20's worth of content... I know which one I would pick

2011-06-29 14:55:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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They did cut out the middle man at the start, it took a few years before cards got started. I'd speculate they exist to capture the market that can't or won't enter their details on the PSN which would have been kids originally but after recent events will probably be alot more people. I never bought a DLC and I intended to enter my Credit Card details to buy Undead Nightmare when PSN came down. I certainly won't now, I'll stick to the PSN cards. It's a shame they only have those of 20€/20$ and 50€/50$ though. I'm also thinking of buying Under Siege so that totals 24€. 50 is too much, 20 isn't enough. Sigh. Now that I mention it... we all know that Pounds>Euros>Dollars, so why the hell does a 10$ product convert to 10€ in Europe and 10? in the UK? Why aren't they priced differently in PS Stores of different regions? According to each currency value it should be 10$ in the USA, 6.9€ in Europe and 6.2? in the UK.

2011-06-29 15:01:00 Author: SnipySev Posts: 2452

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Now that I mention it... we all know that Pounds>Euros>Dollars, so why the hell does a 10$ product convert to 10? in Europe and 10? in the UK? Why aren't they priced differently in PS Stores of different regions? Psychology - pure and simple. If you needed proof that prices are more to do with psychology than with the actual cost of production etc - then there it is. We're not known as "Rip-Off Britain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rip-off_Britain)" for nothing

2011-06-29 15:08:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Oh yeah, DLC is 99% profit for these companies. I mean, a disc based game costs a few mil $ to produce, and then $ 0.99 per disc to manufacture. but DLC costs to produce, and then is all profit. And most of LBP's stuff (stickers and costumes) is just a concept designer sketching sackboy wearing a Judge Dredd outfit, a graphic artist screwing off in Photoshop and Maya for a few hours. And a programmer putting it in game they are the only ones needing payed for their effort, aside from the creators of 2000 AD getting a few cents per DL in royalties, but after it's been produced, it is all profit for MM and 2000 AD. (lol I used Dredd as an example because it's a ludicrous pack for an E rated game.)

2011-06-29 15:18:00 Author: poorjack Posts: 1806

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I never bought a DLC and I intended to enter my Credit Card details to buy Undead Nightmare when PSN came down. I certainly won't now, I'll stick to the PSN cards. It's a shame they only have those of 20€/20$ and 50€/50$ though. I'm also thinking of buying Under Siege so that totals 24€. 50 is too much, 20 isn't enough. Sigh. Now that I mention it... we all know that Pounds>Euros>Dollars, so why the hell does a 10$ product convert to 10€ in Europe and 10? in the UK? Why aren't they priced differently in PS Stores of different regions? According to each currency value it should be 10$ in the USA, 6.9€ in Europe and 6.2? in the UK. Its $10 €10 ?8 generally The ?8 is ?6.20 + 20% VAT + mystery extra charge.

2011-06-29 16:34:00 Author: Rabid-Coot Posts: 6728

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Oh yeah, DLC is 99% profit for these companies. I mean, a disc based game costs a few mil $ to produce, and then $ 0.99 per disc to manufacture. but DLC costs to produce, and then is all profit. And most of LBP's stuff (stickers and costumes) is just a concept designer sketching sackboy wearing a Judge Dredd outfit, a graphic artist screwing off in Photoshop and Maya for a few hours. And a programmer putting it in game they are the only ones needing payed for their effort, aside from the creators of 2000 AD getting a few cents per DL in royalties, but after it's been produced, it is all profit for MM and 2000 AD. (lol I used Dredd as an example because it's a ludicrous pack for an E rated game.) Sony takes part of the cake too for distribution, from everything for Ps3 (except 3rd party hardware since PS3 is open in that matter) Sony takes part of the profit as owner of a platform, MS and Nintendo is no diffrent and any other closed platform do the same or if platfrom is open get money from distributing things from store (Steam for example). this is how you do money out of the platfrom

2011-06-29 17:37:00 Author: Shadowriver Posts: 3991

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Oh yeah, When I said that Video Games were bigger than Movies/Music/Newspapers/Books/Magazines/TV (basically ALL other forms of media) combined... what I meant was that it generates more PROFIT than all of those other mediums combined - not that it is more widely distributed or anything. Think about that for a moment - more PROFIT than ALL OTHER FORMS OF MEDIA COMBINED. And now try and justify the price of DLC

2011-06-30 11:42:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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And now try and justify the price of DLC I'm quite sure that anyone who has ever invested money in a video game company can attest to their continued justification. Lamenting unabashed capitalism is one thing, but I don't think anyone here should pretend that DLC is produced for anything other than additional revenue. It just so happens that we, as consumers, tend to buy games that are high-quality and have great community support. But what happens once we get bored or tired of the same old game? We move on. The video game companies figured that out pretty quick. It's now industry standard to stage DLC to be released in increments in order to continue a revenue stream well past the release date. Just look at the map packs for any FPS, or vanity items for RPGs, and you'll see DLC has been tailored to what gamers want: additional in-game content that keeps those players playing their games.

2011-06-30 14:03:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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I'm quite sure that anyone who has ever invested money in a video game company can attest to their continued justification. Lamenting unabashed capitalism is one thing, but I don't think anyone here should pretend that DLC is produced for anything other than additional revenue. It just so happens that we, as consumers, tend to buy games that are high-quality and have great community support. But what happens once we get bored or tired of the same old game? We move on. The video game companies figured that out pretty quick. It's now industry standard to stage DLC to be released in increments in order to continue a revenue stream well past the release date. Just look at the map packs for any FPS, or vanity items for RPGs, and you'll see DLC has been tailored to what gamers want: additional in-game content that keeps those players playing their games. That's a justification for the existence of DLC - not for it's exorbitant price tag. Just because gamers are stupid enough to pay it - doesn't justify it. I'll repeat it again just in case it hasn't sunk in. "More profitable than ALL other forms of Media combined"

2011-06-30 14:39:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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If it's priced too high, people won't buy it. Just read any article from 2006 regarding the PS3's initial exorbitant cost. Sales sputtered as a result. Now you can purchase one for a third of that price. Stupid is as stupid does, but whether it's "worth it" is in the eye of the bolder. And the phrase 'caveat emptor (http://www.merriam-webstercollegiate.com/dictionary/caveat+emptor?show=0&t=1309441879)' applies here, as always. I'm not arguing that some consumers have no right to feel gouged (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging), but we're talking about entertainment value for cost, which is nearly impossible to quantify.

2011-06-30 14:56:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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If it's priced too high, people won't buy it. Just read any article from 2006 regarding the PS3's initial exorbitant cost. Sales sputtered as a result. Now you can purchase one for a third of that price. Stupid is as stupid does, but whether it's "worth it" is in the eye of the bolder. And the phrase 'caveat emptor (http://www.merriam-webstercollegiate.com/dictionary/caveat+emptor?show=0&t=1309441879)' applies here, as always. I'm not arguing that some consumers have no right to feel gouged (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging), but we're talking about entertainment value for cost, which is nearly impossible to quantify. Yes, we are being Gouged. And it's because we don;t have an alternative supply route. If there was a competitor, who could offer the DLC at a lower price, then the normal rules of market forces/supply and demand would apply. Such as buying 2nd hand DLC from a regular Joe who no longer wants access to the DLC they bought. Where the supply is limited to one vendor - then they can charge what they like (and do) - within reason. Psychology plays it's part here - for instance, the psychological pricing of different regions - because ?8 to someone from the UK - is equivolent psychologically to $8 from someone in the US - despite there being a real difference in monetary value. And as you say - we're talking entertainment - but not just any entertainment. I remember reading in the Economist, during the recession, an article regarding the games industry and how it was having a boom, while most other entertainment companies were going bust. Part of this reason was because gamers view gaming as a life-style - alot are habitually addicted to gaming - and don't view what they spend as 'discretionary spending'. And Games producers take advantage of the habitual nature of gaming by hiring psychologists to make games even more addictive. Of course, caveat emptor applies. But we should still be demanding more for what we pay.. .especially when these companies are laughing at us all the way to the bank. We should be holding the Games Industry to account for it's hugely inflated profit margins and demanding some kind of explanation as to why the DLC is so unfairly priced.

2011-06-30 15:06:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Yes, we are I believe I'm being Gouged. Fixed that. You're entitled to your opinion, but it's not a fact. The redeeming value one places on DLC is up to the individual. And it's because we don;t have an alternative supply route. If there was a competitor, who could offer the DLC at a lower price, then the normal rules of market forces/supply and demand would apply. Such as buying 2nd hand DLC from a regular Joe who no longer wants access to the DLC they bought. Where the supply is limited to one vendor - then they can charge what they like (and do) - within reason. Psychology plays it's part here - for instance, the psychological pricing of different regions - because ?8 to someone from the UK - is equivolent psychologically to $8 from someone in the US - despite there being a real difference in monetary value.Wait, so your complaint is that Sony has the market for all PS3 DLC pinned down, and somehow that isn't fair? That's like going to a Ford dealership and getting upset that they won't sell you a Honda. The market forces are still there, it's just that they behave differently in a closed market than they do in the open market. Or is it that you can't re-sell your DLC? I'm sure there's some sort of legal mumbo-jumbo no this in the User Agreement or your purchase agreement. You sign your right to "resell" away when you buy it in the first place. Currency differences aside, it's about volume. The number of PS3s in Europe is outnumbered (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3#Sales_and_production_costs) by those owned in the U.S. Thus, the actual value when comparing prices is negligible as far as volume is concerned. In addition, the U.S. is still stuck in the worst recession since the Great Depression, so prices are understandably lower to compensate for the weak dollar, increased unemployment and lesser spending. ...And Games producers take advantage of the habitual nature of gaming by hiring psychologists to make games even more addictive. But nobody is addicted to buying DLC. They're addicted to the games themselves. While the game experience may become addictive for some, the act of purchasing DLC is not. It's the behavior of the individual that leads to game addiction in general. DLC has nothing to do with it. Of course, caveat emptor applies. But we should still be demanding more for what we pay.. .especially when these companies are laughing at us all the way to the bank. We should be holding the Games Industry to account for it's hugely inflated profit margins and demanding some kind of explanation as to why the DLC is so unfairly priced.Best way to do that is with your wallet. If you feel it's too expensive, then don't buy it. That's the market at work. Unfortunately, you're outnumbered by the millions who are more than happy to shell out $10 for the latest map pack so they can play with their friends.

2011-06-30 18:46:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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No, I wouldn't say gouging was a matter of opinion... not when the industry themselves have spoken out about it (http://www.develop-online.net/news/32395/Industry-needs-to-get-around-horse-armor-strategies). Also, if you consider that they could charge HALF of what they charge us now - and STILL be the MOST PROFITABLE entertainment medium in the world... then you have to admit that they are over-charging. The thing is, what DLC is has changed from what we were told it would be when the idea first surfaced. At first the idea behind DLC was to "extend" the lifetime of a game, adding additional content. What has happened now, is that developers are with-holding content on the release of a game - in order to sell it to you as an "optional" extra. They've went giddy with the prospect of charging us money for things that, back in the day, would have been an unlockable extras. I know I'm in the minority, which is why "voting with my wallet" is going to have ZERO effect. Unfortunately, the savvy,intelligent 'voter' will always be outnumbered by the "idiot majority". This is the general election all over again (pleasure as always Schm0)

2011-07-01 08:44:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Well, I pretty much only buy DLC for LBP1/2, but I've resigned myself to realizing that there's nothing I can do to reduce the price other than wait on it to go on sale. I still disagree on the gouging, but then again anything I buy nowadays seems too expensive. Ahh, capitalism. (And likewise, Macnme) Also, I think MM must be reading this thread... http://blog.eu.playstation.com/2011/07/01/psn/ LBP DLC on sale!

2011-07-01 13:14:00 Author: schm0 Posts: 1239

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anything I buy nowadays seems too expensive. Ahh, capitalism. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xe1a1wHxTyo

2011-07-01 14:16:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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You don't have to buy DLC. What i hate, is when developers sell DLC that's ALREADY INSIDE THE FRICKIN DISK! When it's bonus stuff, it's okay. BUT WHEN IT'S ALREADY INSIDE THE DISK, I REFUSE TO PAY TO "UNLOCK IT" WHEN IT SHOULD BE MINE AFTER I BOUGHT THE GAME COPY! That's just lame and moneygrabbing.

2011-07-01 19:39:00 Author: Flame Dragon Posts: 312

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DLC is in almost every game now. If any one game DOESN'T have it then they will be losing out on millions of dollars. If I could get millions instead if giving it away I'd probably do it too.

2011-07-05 08:00:00 Author: sp0ngyraver Posts: 407

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