Archive: 10 posts

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I have an idea for a level series that's been brewing in my brain for quite some time. It's a campaign/story game. When I first conceived it, I had thought it would feature a single protagonist but later I decided to set it up with a squad of four so that all four players would have individual characters in multiplayer. Lately, though, I've started thinking that the squad thing would be ill suited to the story I have in mind. So what I'm wondering is what's the best way to handle multiplayer for a story that focuses on a single character? Stick everybody in bots that are variations of the character (different enough that they can tell each other apart, but close enough that they're identifiable as the same character)?--This would be kind of like coop in Halo where both players are Master Chief. Give the main character bot to player one and stick 2-4 in generic soldier outfits even though according to the story there aren't any soldiers with him?--I think that would just be confusing. Alter the story to include a squad of four even though that wouldn't necessarily be the best fit? Any other ideas/thoughts?

2011-03-08 08:22:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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I have an idea for a level series that's been brewing in my brain for quite some time. It's a campaign/story game. When I first conceived it, I had thought it would feature a single protagonist but later I decided to set it up with a squad of four so that all four players would have individual characters in multiplayer. Lately, though, I've started thinking that the squad thing would be ill suited to the story I have in mind. So what I'm wondering is what's the best way to handle multiplayer for a story that focuses on a single character? Stick everybody in bots that are variations of the character (different enough that they can tell each other apart, but close enough that they're identifiable as the same character)?--This would be kind of like coop in Halo where both players are Master Chief. Give the main character bot to player one and stick 2-4 in generic soldier outfits even though according to the story there aren't any soldiers with him?--I think that would just be confusing. Alter the story to include a squad of four even though that wouldn't necessarily be the best fit? Any other ideas/thoughts? Either that or let the protagonist be an NPC; depending on what your story is, the players could follow the main character through the level.

2011-03-08 08:54:00 Author: Chazprime Posts: 587

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That's an idea, but I really like the whole thing where you play as a character who's saving the world and I wouldn't want to rob the player of that by making them a nobody.

2011-03-08 23:25:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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That's an idea, but I really like the whole thing where you play as a character who's saving the world and I wouldn't want to rob the player of that by making them a nobody. I think that wholly depends on how you work out your story, the roles you give players to play and the charm of the title character NPC; if people root for the character (and I bet they are more inclined to do so when their actions has influence on the character and his reponses), then I am sure it'll turn out better than if 4 players would fight over who gets to be the Batman. Batman, and his loyal team of friends, saving the world together.

2011-03-10 02:51:00 Author: Antikris Posts: 1340

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It needs to make sense imo. I hate how those stories play out like in halo/resistance 1 story co-op/etc. It feels weird. Tag the level 1 player only and be done with it. No one wants to watch player 1 play, or be a sub-par secondary character. Well, I dont.

2011-03-10 04:41:00 Author: midnight_heist Posts: 2513

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Tag the level 1 player only and be done with it. No! If I did that, I may as well tag it as broken. No one wants to watch player 1 play, or be a sub-par secondary character. Well, I dont. Agreed. A squad of four players it is then. There'll probably only be as many characters as there are players in-game, though, and the rest will be there for cutscenes, 'cuz teammate A.I. is something even real game devs can't figure out so what chance do I have?

2011-03-10 05:44:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Teammate AI does too exist lol. As a recent example, check out Transformers: Battle for Cybertron for either PS3 or Wii. You play as whatever character you choose, and other 'allies' that are AI help you out.

2011-03-10 07:41:00 Author: Shadow_Wolf_1987 Posts: 108

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Agreed. A squad of four players it is then. There'll probably only be as many characters as there are players in-game, though, and the rest will be there for cutscenes, 'cuz teammate A.I. is something even real game devs can't figure out so what chance do I have? Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, if a level can work just as well in multi, I'm all for it. I definitely wouldn't bother with AI. I am intrigued by your multi or nothing approach... How would you build a level if say, the hero was a one of a kind like Batman that used holo followers? ('cause no one wants to be Robin!) Also, how differently will your level play out if you only have 1/2/3/4 players? Will you only emit the number of players into the cutscenes? Raise the difficulty (count of paint switches, etc) with each player? etc?

2011-03-10 07:50:00 Author: midnight_heist Posts: 2513

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Teammate AI does too exist lol. I didn't mean that it doesn't exist: I just said that devs can't figure it out. Perhaps that was too broad of a statement--some seem to handle it decently. However, there have been quite a few more times where I've been frustrated by my teammates' A.I. than there've been where I was happy with it. In Halo, all the marines would get themselves killed between checkpoints, and and/or they'd rush in headlong when I wanted to try to stay stealthy. I can't specifically recall the teammates in WFC (I like that you picked Transformers as an example, given my avatar ) but they seemed adequate--my only complaint with them is that they were sometimes too effective, not leaving enough fun for me. How would you build a level if say, the hero was a one of a kind like Batman that used holo followers? ('cause no one wants to be Robin!0 That's a good question. I haven't run into that situation in my levels yet, but I'd agree about the Robin thing (I never played Lego Batman in multiplayer but if I had, I'd have been fighting over Batman every time). Fortunately, since I'm doing my own story that's not based on any existing IPs, I can just make a four of a kind squad Also, how differently will your level play out if you only have 1/2/3/4 players? Will you only emit the number of players into the cutscenes? Raise the difficulty (count of paint switches, etc) with each player? I've already done some of this stuff. In my lightsaber level (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=50110-Star-Wars-Jedi-Arts-Lightsaber-Duels) (shameless plug), you fight Darth Vader at the end and his health is proportionate to the number of players: he gets 2x health if there are two players, 3x for 3, and 4x for 4. So there's that. Depending on the situation, I might emit more enemies, just make them tougher, or emit different enemies entirely. I've even considered doing 2x, 3x, or 4x segments in a level, but instead of making them side-branching things, make them part of the main game and emit whichever one is applicable: the actual level design could change based on your number of players (though I would obviously limit this to a few small sections 'cuz the thermometer is limited). As for cutscenes, if I go with a four player squad, they'll all be written into the story so they'll all be there in the cutscenes regardless of the actual number of players. Incidentally, I'm working on another project that by nature doesn't support multiplayer... but I'm building multiplayer support in anyway It's one of those tilt-the-game-so-the-ball-rolls-where-you-want-and-avoid-the-holes kind of games. The way I'm handling multi is I'm setting it so the players take turns (each game is short so you should never have to wait very long). Once one player has succeeded, the remaining players only get two more tries before they all move on to the next game--that way you don't get held up by the guy who can't get it right, but he at least gets a few chances.

2011-03-10 18:11:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Your squad game sounds good. Ah, like those puzzles in R&C. I am making one atm, heh.

2011-03-10 20:10:00 Author: midnight_heist Posts: 2513

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