Archive: 23 posts

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I have a sackbot who does a pretty cool looking double jump. I have an impact sensor plugged into a count up timer. The count up timer plugged into a count down timer. The count down timer is plugged into a one way mover. It's the same double jump from the tutorials on this site. I have a glitch in this double jump though. The impact sensor allows me to only perform one double jump and not continue jumping in the air. The problem with the impact sensor is, when I jump into a wall, itthe impact sensor keeps resetting and I can continue double jumping in the air as long as I make contact with a wall. Is there another way to do a double jump so that the impact sensor doesn't keep resetting just by hitting a wall? By the way, the impact sensor is not on touch.

2011-02-28 03:53:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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Put a tag repsenting the ground and require impact with that tag. Put this tag on all 'ground' sections.

2011-02-28 03:59:00 Author: SSTAGG1 Posts: 1136

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Make sure its set to require a tag (one called "floor" works) and make sure to put that tag on the floor. Make sure the wall is a different object than the floor, and make sure it doesn't have the floor tag on it. Should work after that.

2011-02-28 03:59:00 Author: Madafaku Posts: 738

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You can also put in a circuit that will prevent the sackbot from double jumping if its had an impact in the last 0.2s. I did this and it works quite well without the floor tags. It can be tricked, but it's pretty rare and doesn't give the player any advantage.

2011-02-28 04:02:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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DCF, what do you plug into what, to pull this off. It sounds like both methods works, and pros and cons with both.

2011-02-28 04:09:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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I made mine from scratch, so it's hard to describe what to plug into another circuit. Mine resets like the others when any impact is detected. However, I use a 0.2 second timer as an additional condition. I plug an impact sensor into the reset of the timer and nothing into the timer's input. This makes the circuit false for 0.2 seconds after an impact occurs. Pressing the double jump button during this time does nothing. You can hit a wall, reset your double jump counter and then jump again. However, you need to push off away from the wall to achieve this and by the time 0.2 seconds have passed you're lower than you started. This makes wall climbing impossible. The counter gets reset instantaneously as normal to prevent players from dying because they jumped too quickly and the double jump counter failed to reset. This compares favorably with the floor tag version, which tends to have slightly fewer false positives (you can still get them by hitting the wall or underside of a piece of flooring) but has the obvious drawback of requiring floor tags everywhere. If you want, you can send me a friend request and I'll send you my air jump microchip next time I'm on. You won't need to wire anything as the chip is self-contained. It just gets placed on the sackbots circuit board. The only thing you'll need to tweak will be the color of the controllinator receivers to match your transmitter. (You can also tweak the input button, I use circle.)

2011-02-28 04:49:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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Ok Great. I'm assuming dcf is your PSN name? I think I'll use your method. I just tried the tags. It works, but the problem is, if I'm climbing to a higher area of my level, sometimes the ceiling or wall is the same as the floor in a higher area. So, I'll still be able to double jump off of walls in some places. This method might cause a few headaches for me. I'll send you a friend request just in case I can't get it to work. I'm on right now if you can send it now. OK....I'm gonna need the microchip you were referring to. I'll keep messing with it, but I'm not getting it.

2011-02-28 05:28:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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WHAT?!?!?! Just separate the roof and floor by corner editor in pause, or just smearing a material. Using tags is the best choice. EVERY other way has a draw back.

2011-02-28 10:41:00 Author: Devious_Oatmeal Posts: 1799

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Having to tag every single possible floor surface in a level, and making sure none of the floor surfaces are also walls? That's got huge drawbacks. First of all it imposes restrictions on the visual design. Secondly, it creates maintenance work because every time the level is modified the floors and walls have to be checked to make sure they haven't accidentally been merged or forgotten and left tagged/untagged. Thirdly, it destroys encapsulation of functionality and creates undesirable dependencies. If the creator wants to use the sackbot on another level, he has to repeat the tag-everything process on the new level, and work around the imposed design considerations. If he wants to import the sackbot into an existing level design, the level will have to be modified. Imagine trying to accomplish the tag-every-floor method on one of Pickled-punk's free roam levels. o.O

2011-02-28 11:02:00 Author: munrock2 Posts: 96

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Like i said, Adding tags works, but if theres a way to just add one or two things to a microchip to accomplish virtually the same thing ill do that. Especially if i dont have to screw with my level design.

2011-02-28 12:59:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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Did you get the chip you were askig for? I'm not on that often during the week but you can contact me if you still need a double-jump chip.

2011-02-28 17:43:00 Author: munrock2 Posts: 96

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No I never got it. I guess being onlline at the same time as someone else in another part of the country is a crap shoot sometimes. If you could provide it that would be awesome. My double jump looks great, but like I said, it has that glitch in it. I'm online right now.

2011-02-28 17:47:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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Sorry mate, just got on. It's sent to you now. LBP has a method of sending objects when people aren't online. You go to your saved objects and click square. One of the options is share. This allows you to send a message to a friend with the object attached. If you have any trouble let me know.

2011-03-01 01:57:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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Thanks man.....I really appreciate it. This will keep me from changing my level design by putting tags on all the floors. I will test it out in a few and let you know how it works for me. Just so I know in advance what am I plugging the jump button to?

2011-03-01 02:05:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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You won't need to plug the jump button into anything. A cool feature I only recently figured out is that you can have many controllinators on the same sackbot. This allows you to embed controllinators deep into the logic and avoid the need to run wires all over the place! It also lets us make completely self contained chips that can just be placed on a sackbot and 'magicaly' work without additional wiring. The only thing you need to do is make sure that the receiver color (press square on the controllinator to tweak it) is set to the color of the transmitter you are using. Otherwise it won't register the signal. I think the one I sent you is set to light blue. To do this, open up the microchip I sent and you will see some microchips/controllinators inside. The controllinator inside is a receiver and senses when the player is the transmitter of the corresponding color hits the circle button. (Feel free to change it to a different button.) Another tweak you can make is to the strength of the mover. I like where I've got it, but you may find you want the second jump to be a little higher or a little lower.

2011-03-01 02:18:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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Above you stated that you use circle to jump. Is this chip still set up that way. Sorry I'm asking questions but I won't be able to play for about another hour

2011-03-01 02:35:00 Author: rambo3416 Posts: 179

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what about this? have a holo follower that has an arm that is one small grid square wide that goes down to the bottom of your sackbot in the center. At the end of that, glue another piece of holo with an impact sensor on it. Now the sensor will only register when it hits something directly below your sackbot. You could also connect that to a timer with say a .2 second delay just to eliminate the odd case of something brushing by under him. Then have a NOT gate from it set to the timer reset.

2011-03-01 02:53:00 Author: tdarb Posts: 689

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Above you stated that you use circle to jump. Is this chip still set up that way. Sorry I'm asking questions but I won't be able to play for about another hour Yes, it is currently wired with circle. You can go into the controllinator and wire a different button if you want. It should be fairly obvious since I've compartmentalized that part of the chip. You could also connect that to a timer with say a .2 second delay just to eliminate the odd case of something brushing by under him. Then have a NOT gate from it set to the timer reset. You don't want a 0.2s delay for the reset. Sackboy frequently jumps less than 0.2s after hitting the ground. I use it to prevent sackboy from using the double jump within 0.2s from impact, the reset still occurs instantaneously. False negatives, (unfairly preventing the use of the double jump) are generally more detrimental to game play than the occasional false positive (unfairly giving the player a triple jump). The reason the circuit I'm describing works is because 0.2 seconds after leaving the ground the sackbot is approaching the peak of its jump. 0.2 seconds after impacting an object, sackboy is pretty much at the floor. This prevents wall climbing without requiring floor tags. The counter reset still occurs instantaneously because we don't want the sackbot to have to wait 0.2s before jumping off the floor. One potential negative of my design is that midair collisions (from moving objects like projectiles) will temporarily stop sackboy from double jumping. Personally, I don't mind this so much as it seems a fair penalty for a midair collision. Also, I don't include touching for this penalty so holo will still allow sackboy to double jump. Your idea of using a follower that stays slightly below sackboy is a good one. It will prevent most side impacts from effecting sackboy. However, other holo material could set it off, as well as projectiles that sackboy jumps over, since you'd need to enable touching on the impact sensor.

2011-03-01 03:46:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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Well the timer isn't for the reset. The timer is just to prevent an OFF condition if he happens to briefly pass by something rather than landing on it. It could be set to .1 second, or even .033 depending how it is done. It shouldn't be needed if implemented properly, but it does make an interesting option for a gameplay feature. You don't need your circuit though if all you need to know is that the spot directly under sackboy is touching the ground. just put an impact sensor barely lower than his feet in the center of his body.

2011-03-01 04:07:00 Author: tdarb Posts: 689

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Sorry, I was editing my response while you were writing yours. I put some further details in the post above.

2011-03-01 04:10:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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The under the floor hologram is (overall) a better solution to custom jumping schemes, but it does need the environment tagged to work, without a bunch of false positives for hologram, other sackbots, etc. etc. under your feet. It does however do away with the necessity of differentiating between walls and floor, which is nice for convenience and robustness, also allows for more dynamic landscapes (when does a curved / turning surface stop being a wall and start becoming a floor?) As for DCFs method, it seems fine for a basic double jump, if you aren't too concerned with anything too fancy, though I would suggest one modification - have the timer reset on an inverted impact switch. It will give you almost the same effect, but with significantly improved consistency (i.e. the activation of double jump will be the same regardless of whether you touch the floor then jump or run a bit then jump.

2011-03-01 09:36:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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The under the floor hologram is (overall) a better solution to custom jumping schemes, but it does need the environment tagged to work, without a bunch of false positives for hologram, other sackbots, etc. etc. under your feet. It does however do away with the necessity of differentiating between walls and floor, which is nice for convenience and robustness, also allows for more dynamic landscapes (when does a curved / turning surface stop being a wall and start becoming a floor?) As for DCFs method, it seems fine for a basic double jump, if you aren't too concerned with anything too fancy, though I would suggest one modification - have the timer reset on an inverted impact switch. It will give you almost the same effect, but with significantly improved consistency (i.e. the activation of double jump will be the same regardless of whether you touch the floor then jump or run a bit then jump. My circuit does use inverted impacts (actually NOT gates because I like to visually see the inversion without tweaking the logic component). I agree that the holo + floor tags is the most robust method, as long as you don't forget to tag something while creating/editing.

2011-03-02 01:28:00 Author: dcf Posts: 468

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I agree that the holo + floor tags is the most robust method, as long as you don't forget to tag something while creating/editing. Except of course that there is follower lag... Which is a ***** and can actually cause quite a lot of hassle.... I've managed to reduce it by around 40% using a custom tag-sensing mover combo at the cost of getting occasional jitter for a few frames at the point at which I stop / land. Overall it's working pretty well and the effect of the jitter on the system working seems to be negligible. It's useful for feeding movement info into other systems I have. The whole thing would be so much better if impact sensors could detect only solid objects and followers could be infinite speed... but alas, this is not how things are

2011-03-02 11:23:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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