Archive: 16 posts

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http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=45&pictureid=1243 This statement just in from SCEE: Sony Computer Entertainment and Media Molecule would like to thank everyone in the LittleBigPlanet online community for an amazing start! So far a staggering 84,000 individual levels have been uploaded and more than 27 million level play throughs have been completed. We couldn?t be happier with the initial efforts from our community members; the variety and quality of some of the creations has been astounding. We?ve seen everything from great platform adventures, puzzles and quizzes through to stories and races. We have even had a wedding proposal created entirely in the game! Sony Computer Entertainment and Media Molecule would also like to take this opportunity to praise the fantastic spirit that our online community has displayed. The vast majority of content uploaded to date has been fun and suitable for all of our community members. In a very few cases we have upheld complaints regarding unsuitable content or infringement of intellectual property, with less than 0.5% of levels actively moderated as a result of complaints from other users. Sony Computer Entertainment are committed to continually improving our moderation procedure and the methods of communication we use, in particular regarding the reasons that user complaints are upheld. In the meantime, here are some suggestions for all of our creators: Ensure that the content you share with other users is suitable for all ages - everybody has access to your level if you publish it Please respect other people?s intellectual property rights. For example, don't use images, brands or logos that you?re not entitled to use. If you come across any content that you feel the need to report, then please do it responsibly. Hoax reports will be considered inappropriate behaviour. Source: (http://threespeech.com/blog/2008/11/littlebigplanet-community-content-update/) Thanks to supersickie for the original post.

2008-11-13 13:47:00 Author: QuozL Posts: 921

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I'm still a little concerned about knee-jerk moderation for parody levels where you might use similar names and ideas to copyright protected IP. But we'll see. I'm happy to hear the game is doing well!

2008-11-13 16:51:00 Author: Justin Hopewell Posts: 135

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Eh. This is a loss as far as I'm concerned. We should have the right to publish levels about other intellectual properties, it certainly qualifies as either parody or fair use.

2008-11-13 17:37:00 Author: Arcturian Posts: 18

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So what happens if a copyrighted company has confirmed the usuage of their logo for your level and the mods still delete... I'm confuzzled.

2008-11-13 17:40:00 Author: TheArmedReaper Posts: 1543

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Eh. This is a loss as far as I'm concerned. We should have the right to publish levels about other intellectual properties, it certainly qualifies as either parody or fair use. If you want to make a level that resembles something out of The Legend of Zelda then do it. Just don't call it "Zelda". The same obviously goes for God of War inspired levels. People will get the point of what you've built whether your Sackboy is names Kratos or Professor Chaos.

2008-11-13 17:43:00 Author: supersickie Posts: 1366

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Eh. This is a loss as far as I'm concerned. We should have the right to publish levels about other intellectual properties, it certainly qualifies as either parody or fair use. I've not seen any LBP maps that qualify as fair use. Getting inspiration from anywhere is fair game, but outright usage of name or likeness crosses the line into copyright infringement. Fair use is for things like commentary, news reporting, and teaching. A LBP level is not likely to be any of those. The fact that it is not used commercially doesn't matter in determining a violation.

2008-11-13 18:13:00 Author: Risen Posts: 251

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It's nice to hear from MM/Sony, finally. I just want to point out the possibility, again , that many of the reports of moderated levels could quite possibly be the work of immature or angry players trying to create problems. Just a thought.

2008-11-13 18:30:00 Author: docpac Posts: 601

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It's nice to hear from MM/Sony, finally. I just want to point out the possibility, again , that many of the reports of moderated levels could quite possibly be the work of immature or angry players trying to create problems. Just a thought. Not that far fetched to think people are being malicious with their reports. If that is the case, let's just hope their lack of imagination/creativity really impacts the amount of time they'll spend with LBP.

2008-11-13 19:37:00 Author: supersickie Posts: 1366

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So far a staggering 84,000 individual levels have been uploaded although only 12 of them can be found using the search engine. fixed

2008-11-14 04:05:00 Author: Bokchoykn Posts: 16

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so far a staggering 84,000 individual levels have been uploaded although only 12 of them can be found using the search engine. fixed Lol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!

2008-11-14 04:07:00 Author: Whalio Cappuccino Posts: 5250

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84,000 levels? Where are they? There are probably 20-30 levels on each page, are they saying that there are 2000 pages? I guess the number is for all regions, but still this only reinforces the need for a proper search engine...

2008-11-14 14:26:00 Author: pcostabel Posts: 4

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A fixed search by itself won't help you find good maps you've never heard of very well. What's really needed is a better 'discovery'-based interface as discussed here: https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=t=4636

2008-11-14 15:58:00 Author: Risen Posts: 251

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I've not seen any LBP maps that qualify as fair use. Getting inspiration from anywhere is fair game, but outright usage of name or likeness crosses the line into copyright infringement. Fair use is for things like commentary, news reporting, and teaching. A LBP level is not likely to be any of those. The fact that it is not used commercially doesn't matter in determining a violation. Actually Fair Use is a bit more complex to work out then just does it involve 'commentary, news reporting, or teaching'. There's a a four part legal test involved. 1) "The purpose and character of use..." This is the heart of fair use and has to do with whether or not something is 'transformative' or 'derivative'. This is where you get into whether or not something has artistic, educational, etc goals or whether it is solely about taking advantage of the original work in order to in some way gain profit for the individual. And yes, it does matter if someone is doing it for monetary gain...although not as much as it once did. The crux of this test as applied to LBP is whether or not a level based on something has artistic merits on its own right. And I think this is an arguable position. Certainly though no one (with the possible exception of Sony...) is profiting off making a level in LBP. 2)"The character of the original work" This doesn't really apply to the LBP situation as it has to do with whether the work in question is mostly information or facts (considered public domain) or something more substantial. 3)"Amount and substantiality" Is the copied material one sentence out of a five-hundred page book or is it one sentence out of a three sentence poem? And equally important how important is the element copied? If that one sentence is the heart of the book, then maybe it could still be considered copyright infringement. I think this one is pretty important when it comes to LBP as well. If someone just recreates a single level of Sonic the Hedgehog, have they really copied a large amount of the game? If they could somehow copy the speed as well you might argue that they had copied a substantial part of the game, but without the speed a sonic level plays much differently then with the speed. Similar questions could be raised with other levels based on games. 4)"Effect on work's value" - The Supreme court has labeled this the single most important element in determining fair use. And it should be noted that in cases where profit is not an issue the burden of proof rests on the copyright owner. This has to do with two things. One, does it damage the copyright owner's market? Two, will it devalue the original property and make it less popular. Okay, this is where I think a LBP created level has the best chance. This assumes that we maintain profit is not at issue and the burden of proof lies upon the copyright owner. Were a court to decide that Sony was profiting off the allegedly infringing levels then I think all bets would be off. On a side note relating to this I don't think it should work that way. In LittleBigPlanet the original user is said to have the copyright on their work--if this wasn't the case then there wouldn't have been the fuss over the possibility of a person selling their levels. You can't sell something you don't have the copyright for. Given this fact I would argue that LittleBigPlanet should be seen as being crayons, paper, etc. I might draw a Sonic the Hedgehog picture and then try to sell it, but I'm the one who will be taken to task not the company who makes the paper. Conversely I may make a Sonic the Hedgehog picture and then make a hundred copies and never sell one...the paper company profits, but Sega can't argue that this means someone profited from their character. It has to be the one doing the copying who is profiting, generally speaking. Okay, back on topic. The burden of proof lies upon Sega to prove that a recreation of a Sonic Level in LBP devalues their property or eats into their market. Okay, one: does a Sonic level in LBP cut into Sega's market? I would argue that no significant impact is made. It is not like fewer people will buy the next Sonic game because someone created a Sonic level in LBP. In fact this is downright ludicrous to claim. If anything else the level in LBP will INCREASE Sega's sales by advertising their product. Sega might, however, argue that such a level might cut into future profits should they at some point decide to release an official Sonic LBP level. I still think, though, that they'd have a hard time proving this (remember, burden of proof is on them). Now for number two: does a Sonic level in LBP devalue Sonic? In other words what if I play a terrible Sonic level in LBP and then decide that I hate Sonic? (Insert witty comment about now Sonic level in LBP possibly doing as much damage to Sonic as the official Sonic games have done to him). Again though I think Sega would have a tough fight on its hands. Would a reasonable person really take a bad LBP level out on Sonic? I just don't think so. Sigh, let me catch my breath after all that legalese...okay, I'm back. Are you still with me? Let me conclude. Tests three and four, IMHO, seem to imply that levels created in LBP should fall under the fair use doctrine. Test two doesn't apply and test one is a toss up. All in all it seems to me that an argument can be made for most LittleBigPlanet levels as falling under fair use, even if they use known video game characters and situations. I have no idea what would actually happen if this went to court. This is just my speculation based on the Media Law and Ethics class I took in college a couple years ago. And of course it isn't courts taking this stuff down or even the copyright owners...it's Sony who is trying to cover their own rear end. In other words, it doesn't matter if this stuff is fair use or not, Sony has a right to take stuff off their own network. So I guess we have to hope that Sony loosens up, at least a little bit.

2008-11-21 05:35:00 Author: Unknown User

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Of course fair use is more complex. I was trying to simplify in order to make things easily understandable here. I think most LBP levels fail under the first section, in that they are derivative by using the intellectual property of the original, without being transformative by offering new insight or access to the original work. You can't just make something that has artistic merit and use that as justification for infringing upon someone's IP.

2008-11-21 14:06:00 Author: Risen Posts: 251

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I was searching for the actual quote that had to do with "Good artists borrow; great artists steal" and came across this GREAT T.S. Elliot quote; "Immature poets imitate; mature poets steal; bad poets deface what they take, and good poets make it into something better, or at least something different. The good poet welds his theft into a whole of feeling which is unique, utterly different than that from which it is torn; the bad poet throws it into something which has no cohesion. A good poet will usually borrow from authors remote in time, or alien in language, or diverse in interest." Intellectual property and fair use aside, level designers should consider his argument. Slapping blocks together in some semblance of Mario Bros Level 1-1 is bad poetry. But take the Gradius LBP level on the other hand. The designer took a concept and transformed it. Gradius is NOT a platformer by any stretch of the imagination. This has nothing to do with copyright, just good level design (should note that as of now, I am a TEEEERIBLE level designer). It is fun to play levels that pay homage to a game or genre in a slightly different way.

2008-11-21 17:33:00 Author: cognimetrix Posts: 14

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So far a staggering 84,000 individual levels have been uploaded although only 12 of them can be found using the search engine. fixed Srsly. I published 6 levels. 4 were deleted. That means 2/3 of my levels have been deleted. All with no offensive material. (one was a quiz level, one was an election-mock-voter, the other was a mirror's edge level (which i republished with a different name and fixed some bugs) Ridiculous.

2008-11-22 03:42:00 Author: whatisnarwhal Posts: 164

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