Archive: 90 posts

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I dont want LBP2 to have a flood of levels that copy other games, LBP2 is all about making you're own game and not LittleBig(game name), So i hope that everyone got they thinking caps on. I know im not going to stop everyone but they are other things you could do Take gameplay elements from the game and put it in a different settings make it you own but puting your own take on the game Take inspiron from it

2010-08-31 19:41:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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Well we have to cross the fingers, there will be good creators for sure, but there will always be H4Hers, spammers and the like. Just play the good ones then.

2010-08-31 19:44:00 Author: gdn001 Posts: 5891

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Yohohoo! Yup i my self will be making original and unique levels, but you have to remamber everyone thinks differently, some people just want to see (in put name here) in the cute LBP world, while its boring its just gonna happen, And to add to that, people just like seeing stuff like Sonic or Patapon in LBP thats not a cheap rip off of them, then again im not sure how many cheap rip offs of things i've seen, and im not talking about the Bad versions of games made in to levels A cheap rip off would be... Ohhh like someone makes a rip of of sonic and calls it Speedy the hedgehog etc, And plus a lot of the people are not awesome at making levels like you are, it takes me months my self to make anything nice looking thats still not even close to what i wish i could make :/ And I end up taking most of my stuff down after a while, People will be having fun and most won't care their levels are sometimes next to being junk, yaa.... i sure hope there will be more Pros this time around, but i find that to be unlikely *mew I sure hope i can make my level skills better by then... *sigh*

2010-08-31 20:48:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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I know what you mean, but I also know I love mario, the legend of zelda, metroid, sonic, etc. and I really want to see if someone can make an exact copy of them. Now I definitely don't want to see a flood of cheap, I made this in 20 minutes, re creations. I want to see people put some time and care into perfectly recreating a classic as well as original ideas.

2010-08-31 20:59:00 Author: Unknown User

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I don't think there's need to worry about that. There will be unique levels in LBP2, just like there will be tributes to other games, and just like there will be straight copies of certain games. Myself, I've got two unique level concepts and two tribute concepts in mind already for LBP2.

2010-08-31 21:01:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Its like people making FPSes in LBP. I think thats more of a proof of concept than seriously trying to make a game. If you want to make a FPS. Go UDK or Source. ^^ Want to make a top-down zombie shooter? Go Source + Alien Swarm SDK But when it comes to making short - fun - mix of genres ( top-down + platform ) LBP will be the easiest and probably most giving editor =) EDIT : It sounded alot more on-topic in my head.

2010-08-31 21:03:00 Author: jakpe Posts: 84

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Why not do the exact opposite? Start something so awesome in LBP2 that it will one day have its own game

2010-08-31 21:10:00 Author: napero7 Posts: 1653

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Why not do the exact opposite? Start something so awesome in LBP2 that it will one day have its own game lol thats my plan Check out my ?ropulse project http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=20572&d=1280373365 You check out the teaser in the sig and the updates in LBP2: Projects and Planning. I hope that alot of people do bring original ideas to LBP2. lol The funny thing is that I was going to make a post just like this one

2010-08-31 21:29:00 Author: lyrradXOX Posts: 285

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Im pretty sure there will be those repetitive levels (LittleBigDinner ) but from what I heard, MM is trying to phase out H4Hing by removing that Hearts Trophy. And of course, some people are gonna make exact copies of games. The fun of it is that its in LBP! :SH:

2010-08-31 21:32:00 Author: ThePineapplizer Posts: 769

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Copies of other games lead to well designed gameplay, if copied correctly. Maybe these creators will learn to pick up on why the original developers made them that way. When I made my Deja Q level, I noticed Insomniac led the player into drop down areas by adding point bubbles/tokens. I never noticed this playng the original until I built it myself. LBP2 enables to player to modify sackboy's jumps/etc, which I imagine the main reason for this was for "tribute" levels. I was playing Crash 2 last night. It was fun. I think it would be awesome to do something similar. (your first suggestion)

2010-08-31 21:49:00 Author: midnight_heist Posts: 2513

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Don't worry, there's probably going to be an equal amount, if not a larger amount, of original levels compared to levels based off of other games. LBP2 has so many incredible new features, that it isn't likely people will even want to make game-based levels; I know I sure won't! (not that I ever have..XD )

2010-08-31 22:25:00 Author: Ninjaferret22 Posts: 1403

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but from what I heard, MM is trying to phase out H4Hing by removing that Hearts Trophy. You need to get some new sources. They already have a pin (in-game achievement) for reaching a certain number of hearts.

2010-08-31 22:33:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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You need to get some new sources. They already have a pin (in-game achievement) for reaching a certain number of hearts. http://i848.photobucket.com/albums/ab42/rockmattie/FUUUU.jpg :SH:

2010-08-31 22:36:00 Author: ThePineapplizer Posts: 769

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They need to phase out those heart achievements completely. I remember those pins in motorstormR were as additive as trophies, if not more. And sure, you can say to LBPCentral to be creative, but what about the greater non forum community? They just like real waterz or another bomb survival, and when they get so popular, people try to copy them and what? Did they just get 100,000 plays? Did they just inspire 1000 more kids/people to make another bomb survival? And it's 10x bad if the creator allowed it copy free. My point is, if you want to see original and unique levels, don't allow crap to show up. I too dream for 3 million unique levels. Its like people making FPSes in LBP. I think thats more of a proof of concept than seriously trying to make a game. If you want to make a FPS. Go UDK or Source. ^^ There are around 50 FPS proof of concept levels in two years. 39 of them, not a concept that can work, or are just blocks or weird. Around 5 show a 3D gun, with no enemies. There are 6 levels full FPS levels. 4 of which use 3D guns. Walord_Evils two mini guns levels, sniper_1 'FPS RELOADED' level, and my 'Vietnam:FPS' level. Most of the good FPS levels were create within the last 3 months. 6 out of 3,000,000.

2010-08-31 23:07:00 Author: PPp_Killer Posts: 449

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You need to get some new sources. They already have a pin (in-game achievement) for reaching a certain number of hearts. Dumb MM... when will they learn but its not for a Trophy! Meaning there will be far less heart for heart... as pins will hopefully be far less meaningful to everyone. *mew

2010-08-31 23:16:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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You need to get some new sources. They already have a pin (in-game achievement) for reaching a certain number of hearts. PS: Oh, and I'm pretty sure Spaff said that there won't be a H4H trophy. http://www.littlebigland.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif Source. (http://www.littlebigland.com/your-lbp-2-questions-answered-and-more/)

2010-08-31 23:52:00 Author: Doopz Posts: 5592

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LBP.me should fix this, no one is gonna subscribe to user X who pounds away on bomb survials (or in lbp2 i think the new spam is gonna be zombie survials.) whatever, my hearted creators are gonna be subscribed instantly Poms, jump_button, etc right away, hopefully this system is gonna do away with spammers and get people to actually "TRY" to make a decent game.

2010-09-01 00:23:00 Author: Spyre-wolf Posts: 63

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I don't see the point in recreating other games. Sure, it makes sense in LBP1 because it's pretty difficult. Most of the 'games' people currently make are, quite honestly, pretty bad. It's impressive what the creator has managed to achieve, but not usually fun to play. But in LBP2 it'll be easy. Why make an exact replica of Tetris when I could just go and play actual Tetris?? At least change it up a bit to make it more of your own idea. The only exact game recreations I won't mind seeing are 3D ones like FPS's.

2010-09-01 00:33:00 Author: Nuclearfish Posts: 927

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I don't see the point in recreating other games. Sure, it makes sense in LBP1 because it's pretty difficult. Most of the 'games' people currently make are, quite honestly, pretty bad. It's impressive what the creator has managed to achieve, but not usually fun to play. But in LBP2 it'll be easy. Why make an exact replica of Tetris when I could just go and play actual Tetris?? At least change it up a bit to make it more of your own idea. The only exact game recreations I won't mind seeing are 3D ones like FPS's. Seeing a Exact remake is indeed no fun and we minds will play the real one, however seeing stuff made similar to other things is fun Like sonic as a example, now i don't see the point in trying to make a remake of one of the old sonic games, however making a new level with sonic thats made to have the same feel and looks as sonic old stuff but in the cute LBP world is more then fun if you ask me, *mew

2010-09-01 00:48:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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Am I the only one that sees a sort of.. primordial charm in bare-bones or strange and broken levels? I mean, they get boring after a while, but at least there's a bit more exploration to what weird stuff you can find than the cookie cutter survivals and "FIVE THOUSAND GLITCH PRIZES". At least those levels show me there was some 'crafting' instead of "whelp, I made a large arena of explodable sponge layered with bubbles, let's call it a day." Regardless, there's going to be a huge flux of new levels over the horizon and it would be a tad easier with the new site. I'd love to search online and tally them up for play on the ps3. well.. somebody has to play those poop/banana car stages. haha.

2010-09-01 03:26:00 Author: Cheezy WEAPON Posts: 283

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What bugs me about levels that try to resemble other games is that all that effort went to "copying". I personally don't consider copying itself as something so bad, but what bugs me about it it's that it doesn't involve much creativity, there's no braimstorming. There are creators who really try hard to make the world the give birth to from their imagination come alive; and when they achieve it, boy, the lvl sure gains in charm. But that "charm" factor, that special and personal factor is something you will not find in, lets say, a lvl which purpose is simulating a Ratchet and Clank game. I'm not saying that such lvls will be / are bad, but they are far less "memorable" in my book.

2010-09-01 03:42:00 Author: Keldur Posts: 628

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Well it's a platform for games... I checked the fine print, there was no mention of the terms good, bad, charming or original. I'd fasten your seatbelt, this could be a rough ride!

2010-09-01 04:01:00 Author: Gravel Posts: 1308

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I'm going to make the LBP2 remake of Ramp. It's gonna be epic! Maybe have some rocket cheetahs in it.

2010-09-01 04:20:00 Author: thanatos989 Posts: 248

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I'm going to make the LBP2 remake of Ramp. It's gonna be epic! Maybe have some rocket cheetahs in it. Hehehe.... Anyways what I was going to say on this topic is this: Sure, you will have people making levels with 1,000,000,000 point bubbles in them... Sure, you will have people copying games EXACTLY and not changing a thing... Sure, you will have people copying other people's levels and giving no credit... BUT. You will FO' SHO' see some awesome, unique, and original levels. LBPC alone has a TON of creators who are just itching to take there level ideas and apply them to LBP2. I have a feeling that we will see some amazing levels popping up a few days after the game is released. So don't worry... LBP2 will be awesome.

2010-09-01 04:37:00 Author: ShamgarBlade Posts: 1010

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I have lots of ideas lol LOTS XD!!! but they are different. I hope there wont be to many bomb survivals or shark survivals on lbp2 after Mm made all these new features on lbp2 levels should be a little different from lbp1 hopefully

2010-09-01 04:51:00 Author: HollieCat Posts: 197

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I have lots of ideas lol LOTS XD!!! but they are different. I hope there wont be to many bomb survivals or shark survivals on lbp2 after Mm made all these new features on lbp2 levels should be a little different from lbp1 hopefully People will use the sackbots and start making levels called "Run away from the mob" and you have to run away from a bunch of angry sackbots... oh dear. I hope I haven't just started something...

2010-09-01 05:53:00 Author: ShamgarBlade Posts: 1010

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Who are you to tell people what they can and can't do? On top of that who are you to judge? People get a joy out remaking levels from games, I do and I enjoy playing them aswell a lot of work and effort goes into making them, and it's still creative to implement these games into LBP, there's still a large healthy mix of original levels, their great too it's up to individuals what they want to do, if you dont like it you stay away alright!? One more thing to add, your comment has made me fuming, I assume your a new generation gamer or out of your mind, who else would shun the Golden Era? Don't EVER impose a view like that on the rest of us again!

2010-09-03 21:18:00 Author: Celticdoberman Posts: 26

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OHNOES soon survivals in LBP2 will spread like a zombie infection RUN I TELL YOU RRRRRRRRUUUUUUUUUUNNNNNNN! D;

2010-09-03 21:19:00 Author: The age of LOLZ Posts: 229

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People will use the sackbots and start making levels called "Run away from the mob" and you have to run away from a bunch of angry sackbots... oh dear. I hope I haven't just started something... I blame you >.> Anyways, there will always be people out there who copy people's work. Let's just hope that with all these new tools they will be able to make what they always wanted and be original

2010-09-03 21:30:00 Author: Amigps Posts: 564

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Only subscribe to people that make original levels if you dont want to cycle through remakes. Nuff' said.

2010-09-03 21:53:00 Author: grayspence Posts: 1990

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Who are you to tell people what they can and can't do? On top of that who are you to judge? People get a joy out remaking levels from games, I do and I enjoy playing them aswell a lot of work and effort goes into making them, and it's still creative to implement these games into LBP, there's still a large healthy mix of original levels, their great too it's up to individuals what they want to do, if you dont like it you stay away alright!? One more thing to add, your comment has made me fuming, I assume your a new generation gamer or out of your mind, who else would shun the Golden Era? Don't EVER impose a view like that on the rest of us again! where did i say dont do it? im saying they are other thing you could do to find inspiron from them and make it your own. next time think befor fuming someone and im 25 year old (on 14th of sep) I've play game from way back and still play and enjoy them I was doing a remake only stoped it got a bug on it http://a.imageshack.us/img366/2976/aphoto.jpg did this when i was bord http://a.imageshack.us/img338/457/aphotou.jpg

2010-09-03 22:10:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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where did i say dont do it? im saying they are other thing you could do to find inspiron from them and make it your own. next time think befor fuming someone and im 25 year old (on 14th of sep) I've play game from way back and still play and enjoy them I was doing a remake only stoped it got a bug on it http://a.imageshack.us/img366/2976/aphoto.jpg did this when i was bord http://a.imageshack.us/img338/457/aphotou.jpg Ah He was just Trolling ya,don't let it get to you, anyways interesting stuff you got going on there :3 by the way, what is the first thing a remake of? *mew

2010-09-03 22:26:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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Ah He was just Trolling ya,don't let it get to you, anyways interesting stuff you got going on there :3 by the way, what is the first thing a remake of? *mew lol its only one of the best games ever zelda majora mask http://resetglitch.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/000.jpg anyways off topic here lol

2010-09-03 22:33:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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I don't get this, why are you saying no one should make remakes of other games, when you have just shown that you've worked on remakes of other games? Since when have you been the king who decides who can make what? Personally, I've got lots of ideas to make remakes of games in LBP2, if it's made well and is fun to play, that's all that matters.

2010-09-03 22:39:00 Author: Doopz Posts: 5592

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lol its only one of the best games ever zelda majora mask http://resetglitch.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/000.jpg anyways off topic here lol Oh i have only played most of the zeldas that was one i've missed... heard it was good though, :l anyways~ can't wait to see what kind of one of a kind levels you make with LBP2 c: *sigh* guess i'd better get back to work in Ms paint for the art for my LBP2 level series... i do hope we see some more awesome non junk levels in LBP2 this time around *mew @Doopz479 I never got the idea that he said we should not make remakes? just that he wants to see people make thier own stuff more while only taking some small ideas from other things more of the time~ i think... was a little confused my self.

2010-09-03 22:44:00 Author: Lord-Dreamerz Posts: 4261

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I don't get this, why are you saying no one should make remakes of other games, when you have just shown that you've worked on remakes of other games? Since when have you been the king who decides who can make what? Personally, I've got lots of ideas to make remakes of games in LBP2, if it's made well and is fun to play, that's all that matters. as post in the OP I like to see, I didnt say we had to kill anyone that make a reamke, I just wanted to say they are other ways of finding inspiron from them other then remaking it. and 100,000,000 other are doing that anyway im saying make it your own

2010-09-03 22:49:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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I agree jump_button, hopefully, LBP2's crazy new tools will inspire loads of people to try and come up with something innovative and new.

2010-09-03 22:52:00 Author: X-FROGBOY-X Posts: 1800

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i think the main problem is when people don't really care about the quality, never test it or listen to tips/complains. i can understand when it comes to mario-levels, people just spam out them as bomb survivals! so really- spam and bad quality is allmost the only problem about remaking games...

2010-09-03 22:54:00 Author: >er. Posts: 785

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I see whats going on here, jump_button is telling us not make remakes so they can be the only person creating them and get all the hearts and plays!

2010-09-04 02:15:00 Author: PPp_Killer Posts: 449

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I dont want LBP2 to have a flood of levels that copy other games, LBP2 is all about making you're own game and not LittleBig(game name), So i hope that everyone got they thinking caps on. I know im not going to stop everyone but they are other things you could do Take gameplay elements from the game and put it in a different settings make it you own but puting your own take on the game Take inspiron from it Wish for it all you like, its the first thing everyones gonna' do. It was the same with LBP1, the first thing that happened was retro game remakes. However, once the community suitably 'gets over it', about half a year to a year down the line we'll be seeing the epic tales in a larger proportion again.

2010-09-04 23:09:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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Don't worry jump_button I have been smacked in the face quite a few times with original game ideas, I'm just worried that I'll never get round to making them :O Also, to all those worried about LBP2's equivalent to bomb survivals. Isn't there an MM picks section in LBP2? (or something similar) That'll get good levels the plays they deserve

2010-09-05 18:22:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341

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I don't mind tributes to games, what I hate most are quick 5 minute slap-dash paintinator levels made out of camo material called "MW2 tributes." Put some effort into making it good. I've got a ton of original ideas, but I'm not that good at creating so I don't know if they'll ever see the light of day.

2010-09-05 20:14:00 Author: Arkei Posts: 1432

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So shall we keel Johnee for his awesome RTS he made because there's other existing games of that nature? Shall we kill him for his epic awesome space shooter? //sarcasm

2010-09-05 20:19:00 Author: Unknown User

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The thing I have a problem with is you can almost guarantee gaming websites are going to do "The 50 best LBP2 levels!" lists a few weeks after release. And because these are usually written by people who don't look very hard for good stuff, most of those levels will be game remakes. I can see it now: "Wow, somebody has remade Tetris exactly like the original! This is the best LBP2 level out there because it's familiar to our limited imaginations, and because our website is popular thousands of people will see that this is the best level ever." And then you've got people who take an idea like Tetris, turn it's completely on its head and make something that nobody has ever seen before. It'll be incredible, far better than a simple remake, and will just ooze creativity and awesomeness. Yet this will be ignored by the majoirty of players simply because it 'isn't' exactly the same as the original. After all, who cares that there are unlimited possibilties of different and new game ideas you could make when we can play hundreds of versions of the same old classics, right? EDIT: So, I suppose what I'm trying to say, at the end of the day I don't mind seeing loads of remakes. I just don't want to see people making a massive fuss about them.

2010-09-05 20:43:00 Author: Nuclearfish Posts: 927

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And because these are usually written by people who don't look very hard for good stuff, most of those levels will be game remakes. I can see it now: "Wow, somebody has remade Tetris exactly like the original! This is the best LBP2 level out there because it's familiar to our limited imaginations, and because our website is popular thousands of people will see that this is the best level ever." Prime example: I don't know if you are aware of this but a few weeks ago somebody made a LIMBO level and a video of it got posted on Youtube. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFvB3LNbs_U) The level itself isn't bad apart from too many things on screen making the frame rate drop. However I guess some guy from a popular gaming blog found the video and posted it. A few days later I found this level on all of the gaming sites I'm subscribed to via RSS, like Joystiq. Anyways, I'm sure the creator spent alot of time on the level and it certainly does deserve plays. However, there are loads more waay cooler levels that don't get any attention outside the game because they aren't based around popular ip's. Rant over.

2010-09-06 12:13:00 Author: olit123 Posts: 1341

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Oh, the creative stream will come to everyone, I assure you *brings forth my bazooka* :kz: Anyway... I do take Jump_button's side on always giving things your own twist, copies I am not too fond of, only if they are done better, which rarely happens. And about Zelda, it reminds me, anybody knows if I can buy the old games through Wii online shop or whatever it is called to play them on the Wii? I would love to play those classics again!

2010-09-06 15:05:00 Author: moonwire Posts: 1627

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Name an "original" game then. Name one game that takes no inspiration from games that preceeded it? There's no such thing as "original" anymore... it's all been done before. Remaking Lemmings - or Remaking Lemmings in a LBP style - what's the difference? It's *still* just a lemmings remake

2010-09-06 15:05:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Name an "original" game then. Name one game that takes no inspiration from games that preceeded it? There's no such thing as "original" anymore... it's all been done before. Remaking Lemmings - or Remaking Lemmings in a LBP style - what's the difference? It's *still* just a lemmings remake :b LBP, Mario 64, Ico, SotC, flower, another world, wish game devs stop playing it safe with all FPS's

2010-09-06 17:43:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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Ya, first person shooters are a bit repetititititive after a while. Though myself I do accept a well made one with a special twist, like portal or bioshock

2010-09-06 17:53:00 Author: moonwire Posts: 1627

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:b LBP, Mario 64, Ico, SotC, flower, another world, wish game devs stop playing it safe with all FPS's The only one I would give you there is Flower. LBP is a Platformer mixed with a Level Editor - both unoriginal features. Mario 64 was the - what was it - 15/16th Mario title - hardly original. ICO/SotC - another Platform/Puzzler - albeit a nicely packaged one Another World - More Platforming (and was a Prince of Persia clone) Flower is the only one with a hint of originality... but even then it's just a mix of genres - none of the genres mixed were new or original. There's no such thing as a truely "original" title anymore.

2010-09-06 18:03:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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I totally agree (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=33234-LBP2-Nightmares) with jump_button. There are already a ton of spam levels on the servers. That is bad enough. However, the last thing that I want to see is a bunch of otherwise talented creators spending their time creating remakes when they could be making original levels. I don't know anything about programming games, so I;m going to use LBP2 to make all of my *original* ideas a reality. Or, I'll be too lazy to make a single level, like it's been in LBP1...

2010-09-06 18:05:00 Author: Stoicrow Posts: 276

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I totally agree (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=33234-LBP2-Nightmares) with jump_button. There are already a ton of spam levels on the servers. That is bad enough. However, the last thing that I want to see is a bunch of otherwise talented creators spending their time creating remakes when they could be making original levels. I don't know anything about programming games, so I;m going to use LBP2 to make all of my *original* ideas a reality. Or, I'll be too lazy to make a single level, like it's been in LBP1... But look at this from a creators perspective. You could make your "original" game (that's actually just a lemmings/command & conquer/whatever IP clone) and hope that people play it. Or you could make it an (un)official Clone of the IP and you'd be guaranteed more plays, just because fans of the original IP would want to play it. Although, this backfired spectacularly for me with my 2000AD Judge Dredd levels, despite them being original and "LBP" - alot of people, because they are unfamiliar with the 2000AD/Judge Dredd IP, were actually discouraged from playing it. Even players have commented that it deserves more plays - and because it's got hardly any plays, people think it *must* be a bad level

2010-09-06 18:30:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Actually, in my experience, the really good levels usually aren't the ones that get hundreds of thousands of plays and hearts- that's usually spammers thing. That fact probably saddens me more than anything else about LBP.

2010-09-06 18:50:00 Author: Stoicrow Posts: 276

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I tend to go by "heart" percentage when levels don't have alot of plays. if it's above a 1 in 5 Hearts to Plays Ratio - then I'll give it a shot.

2010-09-06 19:07:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Original and unique? No, I don't think I can manage that. I think I'll follow the flock and do bomb survival levels. They seem to be quite popular.

2010-09-07 09:34:00 Author: Ungreth Posts: 2130

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The only one I would give you there is Flower. LBP is a Platformer mixed with a Level Editor - both unoriginal features. Mario 64 was the - what was it - 15/16th Mario title - hardly original. ICO/SotC - another Platform/Puzzler - albeit a nicely packaged one Another World - More Platforming (and was a Prince of Persia clone) Flower is the only one with a hint of originality... but even then it's just a mix of genres - none of the genres mixed were new or original. There's no such thing as a truely "original" title anymore. Echocrome?

2010-09-07 10:18:00 Author: ladylyn1 Posts: 836

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Name an "original" game then. *sigh* Either you are being deliberately quarrelsome or you really are completely missing the point. Just because something is influenced by that which came before it does not mean it cannot be original. There is also a world of difference between a creating a carbon copy of something vs. taking inspiration from it, and also from a number of other sources, be they video games, films, literature, music, painting, sculpture, architecture, real life experiences... whatever, throwing in a little bit of yourself and wrapping up the whole thing in a coherent package. The latter is what jump_button is talking about, not "inventing an entirely new genre of game". Obviously if you are simply oblivious to that difference then I'm sorry. And by that I don't mean I'm apologising, I mean that I feel sorry for you

2010-09-07 10:57:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Super Mario 64 literally invented the 3D platformer genre, setting the foundation for a hundred games after it, including the use of the analog stick and camera controls.

2010-09-07 11:12:00 Author: GruntosUK Posts: 1754

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Echocrome? Echochrome has a hint of originality to it... but when I played it I found it remind me very heavily of perspective puzzle version of Marble Madness - probably because of the aesthetics. But considering the plethora of games out there, it's quite saddening to see how few truely "original" titles there are. There's nothing wrong with remaking the classics in LBP2 - especially if they are done well... no-one can tell me that RRR30000's remakes of classic arcade titles didn't advance what we thought was possible in LBP... it'll actually probably help to reveal alot of the capabilities of the logic tools in LBP2... which we can then use to try and make something original or tailored to LBP. Even if the closest we get to "original" is just mixing genres that haven't been mixed before.

2010-09-07 11:59:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teMlv3ripSM .................

2010-09-07 12:08:00 Author: Syroc Posts: 3193

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It's not an argument... it's a discussion

2010-09-07 12:37:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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The only one I would give you there is Flower. LBP is a Platformer mixed with a Level Editor - both unoriginal features. Mario 64 was the - what was it - 15/16th Mario title - hardly original. ICO/SotC - another Platform/Puzzler - albeit a nicely packaged one Another World - More Platforming (and was a Prince of Persia clone) Flower is the only one with a hint of originality... but even then it's just a mix of genres - none of the genres mixed were new or original. There's no such thing as a truely "original" title anymore. Well if you want to be like that, there are no original stories and haven't been for centuries. You do realise that even shakespeare was heavily influenced by Greek stories? Seriously the ancient Greeks were incredibly prolific with their literature. However, young people will never know the stories of the generations more than about 50 years before their time (unless they really go out of their way) so we don't mind so much that stories get repackaged. And anyway; LBP was the first real commercial multiplayer platform game with a powerful tools to allow user content creation and distribution. So yes, that is pretty **** original. How about half-life 1? That was perhaps the first cinematic first person shooter, its got great storytelling and every shooter before that was a mindless blasty doom/quake clone. I don't like how you think combining and expanding on existing genres doesn't count as original.

2010-09-07 12:50:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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*sigh* Either you are being deliberately quarrelsome or you really are completely missing the point. Just because something is influenced by that which came before it does not mean it cannot be original. There is also a world of difference between a creating a carbon copy of something vs. taking inspiration from it, and also from a number of other sources, be they video games, films, literature, music, painting, sculpture, architecture, real life experiences... whatever, throwing in a little bit of yourself and wrapping up the whole thing in a coherent package. The latter is what jump_button is talking about, not "inventing an entirely new genre of game". Obviously if you are simply oblivious to that difference then I'm sorry. And by that I don't mean I'm apologising, I mean that I feel sorry for you Didn't notice this post, but deserves a response. It all depends on the amount of "influence". Is taking a bunch of other peoples ideas and then repackaging them as your own an "original" work, or are you plagiarising? (Avatar anyone?) At what point does it stop being a "carbon copy" and become an "homage"? And at what point does it stop being an "homage" and start to become your own original work? & you are also belitteling the amount of work that some of these guys have went to to recreate a 'perfect' carbon copy of their favourite game within LBP... just because it's an existing title - does it make it a worse level? I'm fully aware of all of the points being made in this thread... are you? Innovation & Originality are two different things. For instance - LBP mixed a platformer with a level editor - It's wasn't original - both of those concepts already existed- but it was 'innovative' because the two hadn't been put together so perfectly before.

2010-09-07 12:58:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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So according to Macnme, no remix artists or DJs can ever produce original work?

2010-09-07 13:38:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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At what point does it stop being a "carbon copy" and become an "homage"? And at what point does it stop being an "homage" and start to become your own original work? See, now I know you are just trolling, because you're asking questions like this that cannot have a distinct answer. Not only is it a sliding scale (rather than hard black and white), but also you can't quantify something like this, it's more subtle and largely down to qualitative measures. However, there are various commonly held concepts amongst academic, artistic, business and legal circles as to what these things are. The version that you are implying is well out of line with any of those, hence why just about everyone is disagreeing with you, because you are being rather ignorant. Name an "original" game then. Name one game that takes no inspiration from games that preceeded it? As far as I can tell, your view is something along the lines of: "it has some element of <insert genre> in there, I've seen an <insert genre> before. Therefore: 0 originality" which is sheer idiocy - you might as well say: "well it's a video game, I've played pong (which can also be classified as a video game), therefore it's a clone of pong". & you are also belitteling the amount of work that some of these guys have went to to recreate a 'perfect' carbon copy of their favourite game within LBP... just because it's an existing title - does it make it a worse level? No, I said it makes it less original and I didn't actually say there was anything wrong with being unoriginal. Ironically, you implied that games / levels that are unoriginal are worse, when you said: it's quite saddening to see how few truely "original" titles there are. Of course, that is based upon your aforementioned interpretation of the concept of originality, so I'm not surprised you can't find originality in any games ever. Basically, your whole argument (if we put aside the inconsistencies and contradictions in what you're saying) boils down to your personal, overly simplistic, interpretation of the meaning of the word "original". As for your other points: That creators making homage levels to up their plays makes sense: Does the term "Selling out" mean anything to you? If your primary interest is gaining hearts and plays then more fool you. That creators making direct replicas can push back the boundaries of what can be achieved: You can do the same with original gameplay concepts as well. If you'd like to raise any other points I'll be happy to treat them with equal quantities of disdain @Asbestos: of course they can't, but neither can any other musicians. After all, I've heard pretty much every frequency of sound before, all these "musicians" do is recombine those waveforms into other patterns.... Sheesh, what a cop out

2010-09-07 13:59:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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@Asbestos: of course they can't, but neither can any other musicians. After all, I've heard pretty much every frequency of sound before, all these "musicians" do is recombine those waveforms into other patterns.... Sheesh, what a cop out Haha, that was so predictable, yet I couldn't help breaking out into a big grin. EDIT: Almost forgot Getting back to Jump's original post. I'm sure there'll be plenty of original levels to satisfy, there will still be the re-makes and tribute levels too. Personally I get no thrill out of re-making an already existing game or overused concept. I've already started planning a number of projects from games and levels to concepts and gimmicks. Hopefully the new tools and features will inspire creators to be more, well, creative. Not that I see anything wrong in a re-make, I actually think it will be quite interesting to see who makes the closest replica of Mario Bros.

2010-09-07 14:14:00 Author: SR20DETDOG Posts: 2431

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No, I don't regard these DJ's and Mix's as original in the slightest. I've been on music workshops with Guitarists, Bassists, Drummers, Singers, Piano players, and DJ's.... and at night the DJs would sit seperately away from the rest of the real "musicians" while we were all jamming and improvising, because they were incapable of creating music without "mixing" other peoples music together. They may "innovate" by mixing songs/genres/styles that haven't been combined before - but they are not being "original". And as a musician, I know how hard it is to come up with something truely "original" (that doesn't borrow heavily from an existing style/genre/chord progression - or doesn't rhyme "maybe" with "baby" etc), it's nigh on impossible. And as has been pointed out - it's a grey scale betwen "Carbon Copy" to "Original Work" and you can;t actually define what you mean by "original". The people making remakes are "innovating" by creating a LBP version of whatever game they are insterested in.... and there is nothing wrong with that, just as there's nothing wrong with people listening to a new mix of a classic song. Someone could make a remake of a classic game - and in doing so - create new logic (originality) and be the only one who uses it (uniqueness). So we have a remake level that is both original & unique. Be as disdainful as you like, it doesn't lessen my point. (but it does lessen yours - as any future points will be made "out of disdain" rather than for being a valid point - & as a mod you should know better)

2010-09-07 14:46:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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*brain explodes*

2010-09-07 15:30:00 Author: moonwire Posts: 1627

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No, I don't regard these DJ's and Mix's as original in the slightest. I've been on music workshops with Guitarists, Bassists, Drummers, Singers, Piano players, and DJ's.... and at night the DJs would sit seperately away from the rest of the real "musicians" while we were all jamming and improvising, because they were incapable of creating music without "mixing" other peoples music together. They may "innovate" by mixing songs/genres/styles that haven't been combined before - but they are not being "original". And as a musician, I know how hard it is to come up with something truely "original" (that doesn't borrow heavily from an existing style/genre/chord progression - or doesn't rhyme "maybe" with "baby" etc), it's nigh on impossible. And as has been pointed out - it's a grey scale betwen "Carbon Copy" to "Original Work" and you can;t actually define what you mean by "original". The people making remakes are "innovating" by creating a LBP version of whatever game they are insterested in.... and there is nothing wrong with that, just as there's nothing wrong with people listening to a new mix of a classic song. Someone could make a remake of a classic game - and in doing so - create new logic (originality) and be the only one who uses it (uniqueness). So we have a remake level that is both original & unique. Be as disdainful as you like, it doesn't lessen my point. (but it does lessen yours - as any future points will be made "out of disdain" rather than for being a valid point - & as a mod you should know better) Is someone taking the discussion too seriously?

2010-09-07 15:38:00 Author: ladylyn1 Posts: 836

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I'm not taking this seriously at all as it happens. What can I say... I just enjoy a good discussion, especially if I'm in the minority view

2010-09-07 15:51:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Be as disdainful as you like, it doesn't lessen my point. (but it does lessen yours - as any future points will be made "out of disdain" rather than for being a valid point & as a mod you should know better Well, my being a mod is irrelevant here, but one thing I do know is that "being disdainful" and "having a valid point" are certainly not mutually exclusive (I'm not sure where that idea came from either) and I assure you that I will have valid points to back myself up, whatever tone I choose to adopt to convey them But going back, I don't see how making a carbon copy in LBP is real innovation in itself*, any more than duplicating an oil painting in watercolours could be considered innovative. And I still don't understand how you could call that innovative and original, but claim that something like flower isn't.... But bringing this back round to the original point of the thread, which was to try and promote a desire for creators to stretch their imaginations a little bit beyond making carbon copies, tribute levels and littleBig<InsertGameName> levels. To try and innovate, to aspire create their own characters, worlds, stories, gameplay mechanics and visual styles. Do you really think that's a bad thing? *Though maybe some of the techniques used to achieve the end could be - but then that in turn is less likely to be the case in LBP2, as nuclearfish points out on page 2 of this thread and TBH. I also don't see that the lack of originality in the end product actually drives innovation in techniques more than aiming for something more original.

2010-09-07 16:05:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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well I am a fan of horror games and I always make my own original stuff but I due use ideas and inspirations from older games as a tribute to them :-) I always get a smile when someone points that out.

2010-09-07 16:44:00 Author: Delirium Posts: 349

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I shall try and make fun levels. In fact I'm happy if they are fun to create. Don't really care about originality or uniqueness. Fun all the way.

2010-09-07 16:46:00 Author: Syroc Posts: 3193

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I've got a few originals planned for littlebigplanet 2, first one is in my avatar and signature ^^ Yes paint sucks

2010-09-07 16:50:00 Author: Kn0cked-0ut Posts: 562

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You can be original in lots of ways but if you just copy and remake then you are not being original, and dont think about play's so much, Its nice if a level get alot but they are other things beside that.

2010-09-07 16:59:00 Author: jump_button Posts: 1014

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I've been thinking of the idea of creating ( whenever I feel like it ) until LBP3 is released and take the player on a journey through whatever I've made. It'd be fun but I'd probably be burned out fairly quickly.

2010-09-07 17:09:00 Author: BasketSnake Posts: 2391

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Dude there will be... Just look on LBP2 filter's! They split up levels into categories now, so you can find whatever your looking for! Also, there is a 'You' category where you can select can select your favourite types of levels and creators.

2010-09-07 17:16:00 Author: sackruler905 Posts: 103

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Will there be an "originality" filter for Macnme? "Sorry, no results were found for your search."

2010-09-07 17:22:00 Author: Unknown User

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Will there be an "originality" filter for Macnme? "Sorry, no results were found for your search." Well, I'm more defending my own project. The first thing I thought of when I saw LBP2 was "WOW, I could finally recreate 'Talisman'" - it's probably the greatest board game ever made - and hasn't managed to be made into a computer game yet. It was in development over XBOX live but got dropped. I did try a version in LBP1 but the thermo quickly put a stop to that. Now, it's going to take a heck of alot of logic and innovation in order for me to translate that board game into a playable 4 player turn based level in LBP2. (I've got alot of my own original ideas on how to best translate it into LBP2) It hasn't been done before - so is it original & unique? In a way yes. It's also a copy (not a carbon one) of a pre-existing title - so in another way, it's not original or unique at all. What it is, is subjective. And I'm not remaking it out of Laziness or from a lack of my own ideas - but because I've got a good idea of how it could be done & it's something I would like to see... I don't care about plays or hearts (though they are always nice), I'm not sure how many people have even heard of Talisman. It'd actually be easier (& the lazier option) for me to work on my own ideas than to take on this mammoth task. I'd be remaking it out of love for LBP & for Talisman. & I'm actually looking forward to seeing all of my favourite classic games being remade through a LBP2 lens. And I'd rather them be a faithfull recreation of the original, than an "almost but not quite" attempt by replacing every instance of a word with the word "Sack", and then claiming it to be original. (which would pass for originality by the definition of this thread). Because by the OP - Pong is a no no, But "SackPong" is a yes yes... I'm saying they're both just pong And original Idea or Remake of a pre-existing idea; I say - it doesn't matter - what matters is "Is it a good, playable level?" What's wrong with using a tried and tested idea? The entire game development community don't seem to have a problem with it. (another military shooter anyone?) Original doesn't always equate to Good - Improvisational Jazz is the perfect example.

2010-09-07 17:39:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Stuff I think you're misunderstanding again. Simply replacing words with 'Sack' obviously makes no difference. Take my Deflectorball level for example. That's based on a minigame from Crash Bash.Essentially it's the same rules - 4 players in a square arena, each defending a goal and you have to knock balls into your oppenents goal to take them out. In fact I didn't change much about the gamplay at all. However, it's MORE than just an exact copy because all I 'copied' was the basic idea. The theme and visuals were entirely my own, and there were a few gameplay limitations I had to make because it was difficult to make in LBP1. I'm going to make another in LBP2, and all those limitations will be gone, but I'm going to be take the idea even further than what was in Crash Bash. I could add powerups, a team version of the game, my own music, even enemies and stuff. What I'm trying to say is the IDEA may be taken from an existing game, but the way I execute that I idea is entirely my own. Why would I want to make something exactly the same as the original, when I can do something BETTER? When I could put my own twist, or at least make it LOOK different from the original? I also refer to what I said earlier in the thread - I still don't have a problem if somebody recreates a game exactly. What I DO have a problem with is when EVERYONE recreates games and it becomes the only way to get any recognition.

2010-09-07 19:47:00 Author: Nuclearfish Posts: 927

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It hasn't been done before - so is it original & unique? In a way yes. It's also a copy (not a carbon one) of a pre-existing title - so in another way, it's not original or unique at all. Sounds like your contradicting yourself. Anyway, I think a lot of confusion in this thread is being caused because everyones view of words like 'original' and 'innovative' mean something different, so heres googles answer. Innovation is a new way of doing something or "new stuff that is made useful". It may refer to incremental and emergent or radical and revolutionary changes in thinking, products, processes, or organizations. Original : being or productive of something fresh and unusual; or being as first made or thought of; "a truly original approach"; "with original music"; "an original mind" So to clarify those definitions, Originality is when something is done for the first time, innovation is when the idea is developed or expanded upon in a small or big way. LBPs gameplay will only ever be derivative or innovative (neither Mm's levels nor user created content), it will never be original. No one can make a level/game in LBP1 or 2 that will be 'original' because there will be an something with a similar gameplay element or mechanic in another game or level that is similar or identical to it that predates it. The games industry has been around for a while now. With regards to story telling, again, we can't possibly be original. The ancient Greeks have already done everything. Seriously. However we can innovate; we can play with the themes and the personalities of our characters and that won't make them any less enjoyable just because the story is essentially Homer's Odyssey's or Pocahontus.

2010-09-07 20:57:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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Oh good, you're a google genius But I totally agree with Nuclearfish & Asbestos(Honestly, I'm NOT a troll!), In fact it's what I've been saying this whole time. I don't mean it as an insult Nuclearfish, but your's isn;t an 'original' level... you've taken a pre-existing idea and innovated on it by adding other pre-existing ideas. It's innovative and inventive, but is it really "original", you said yourself, you 'copied' the core idea? This whole discussion highlights for me the strange legal loophole/blackhole/minefield/other dimension where Little Big Planet exists, in concern to copyright (Intellectual property ie; The "Original" creator). That's mostly caused by the outdated copyright laws that aren't fit for the modern age. For example; My 2000AD Judge Dredd levels... are my own unique and original creations, based entirely on my own story lines... if I worked for 2000AD and it was a comic storyline I'd get writers credits. As it is, the only official "permission" I have to recreate any 2000AD stuff (aside from fan art) is from the licenced material in the 2000AD DLC pack. After I downloaded it I noticed there weren't any proper "Judge Dredd" levels, only "Here's What You Get in the 2000AD DLC" levels. So I decided to make one of my own. (2000AD first day on the job)....I love 2000AD/Judge Dredd and I've read it since I was a child (that's *read* people, not *watched*, - there WAS NO movie with Rob ***** Schnieder!!!) & it was my first attempt at a "proper" LBP level. I put in some original ideas, like using a Badge sticker to arrest any character you see in the level, and it reveals a funny bit of dialogue for a trumped up charge and an over zealous punishment. It's set in the 2000AD universe, but it's all my own take on it. Now, say for instance, I started making videos of these levels (as many people do - I personally have no interest) and uploaded them to youtube, and that youtube channel attracts enough interest to warrant advertising... then there is money involved... and where there is money, there'll be a lawyer trying to take it While all of these ideas in the level were my own & I created the entire level from scratch... the idea of Judge Dredd, and of 2000AD and all of the references I make in the level are not, so they could reasonably 'stake a claim'. And as it's all seen through the filter of LBP, Mm could also make a good case for a stake in that cash. So who exactly is the true 'Intellectual Property' owner of content like my 2000AD levels? Is it the writer/creator (myself) Is it the publishing company that bought the rights to the 2000AD copyright? Is it Media Molecule?! I really don't know.... just like the grey sliding scale concept of Copy/Homage/Original Content that Nuclearfish's level seems to have been through... it's a mysterious grey area that'll only become a legal problem once there's money involved. There's the same issue with my LBPt 4 Dead level - it's all my own work, my own take on Left 4 Dead, but in a Little Big Planet style. Or even the fantastic Star Wars series from Julesyjules... what is the official copyright position on that? What about in LBP2 - where we'll have the option to make "Cinematic Cut Scenes", where people will copy and recreate, word for word scenes from films they like... all be it in a jokey LBP style. Like people recreating all of the scenes from "The Godfather" (Sackfather *sigh*) And that's kind of my point also, You can't help but imprint some of yourself onto the things you create. Even if they are copies of something else. Just like an instrument, different people 'play' LBP differently, based on their skill with the 'instrument' that is create mode. If everyone is making a "carbon copy" of an existing IP, then why are all of these "Carbon Copies" different from each other? Let people create what they want. If existing IP creations top the bill of popular levels, then that's the players fault, not the creators. They're probably doing it (like myself) out of love for the material they are emulating. & How can that be a bad thing?

2010-09-07 21:23:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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The copyright issues in lbp are only ever addressed if the copyright holder contacts Mm or Sony, and only then will they moderate any offending levels. In the beginning the moderation system was very over zealous, deleting levels permanently because they had copyrighted IPs in them. People didn't like this, so they adopted a new approach where they basically sat around until any complaints came in...which we can only presume hardly ever happened, because the moderations stopped Anyways, why would nintendo insist on a sony exclusive to stop referencing mario all of the time? It's like free advertising!

2010-09-07 21:51:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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Exactly, it's not a problem till someone complains about it, but how many guilty parties are there? How many levels would be wiped if Nintendo or Sega's Lawyers made one phone call to Mm? Would they take down Julesyjules' levels if George Lucas called? And would that include any "Sack" versions of these IP's? It's a completely grey area. Legally I think you could argue that it's 'parody' or 'social commentary'.

2010-09-07 22:04:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Exactly, it's not a problem till someone complains about it, but how many guilty parties are there? How many levels would be wiped if Nintendo or Sega's Lawyers made one phone call to Mm? Would they take down Julesyjules' levels if George Lucas called? And would that include any "Sack" versions of these IP's? It's a completely grey area. Legally I think you could argue that it's 'parody' or 'social commentary'. I'm pretty sure theres probably a clause somewhere that says all content is owned by Mm and therefore sony and therefore its up to their moderation systems to keep it under control. And even if you did have any rights over what you make in LBP, then Sony definatly wouldn't put any money towards legal fee's to protect your right to parody. Which means in turn i'm pretty sure you can't hide behind fair use and say "but i'm not making any money from it", which is true you aren't, but Mm and thus sony are, as the fact that its content in a game they sell.

2010-09-08 01:05:00 Author: Asbestos101 Posts: 1114

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The thing is, it doesn't even need to be hosted by Media Molecule. You could just be making a video using LBP as the platform and infringing on an IPs copyright with the content. If it features Sackboy, you are infringing on Mm copyright... and if Sackboy is running through a level based on an IP, then you are infringing on that aswell. According to the letter of the law, media molecule are breaking it right now (but as no one is complaining, no-one cares - me included )

2010-09-08 10:32:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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Which means in turn i'm pretty sure you can't hide behind fair use and say "but i'm not making any money from it", which is true you aren't, but Mm and thus sony are, as the fact that its content in a game they sell. Hmm, sounds like a slippery slope. They're making money selling the tool to make the content, but not the actual content itself. Can you sue MicroSoft because they make money off Visual Studio (or Windows, for that matter) which can be used to make tools for piracy? But going back, I don't see how making a carbon copy in LBP is real innovation in itself*, any more than duplicating an oil painting in watercolours could be considered innovative. And I still don't understand how you could call that innovative and original, but claim that something like flower isn't.... *Though maybe some of the techniques used to achieve the end could be - but then that in turn is less likely to be the case in LBP2, as nuclearfish points out on page 2 of this thread and TBH. I also don't see that the lack of originality in the end product actually drives innovation in techniques more than aiming for something more original. I think the techniques invented to copy gameplay in LBP2 will still be innovative. Sure, lots of stuff will become easy to do, but that just exposes new frontiers, and IMHO trying to replicate something exactly is a great way to explore those frontiers. As an aside, I thought Flower wasn't all that original, it felt like a flight simulator with quirky controls (but I could be wrong, I only played the demo). What bugs me about levels that try to resemble other games is that all that effort went to "copying". I personally don't consider copying itself as something so bad, but what bugs me about it it's that it doesn't involve much creativity, there's no braimstorming. I totally disagree. Most games won't transfer one on one, you have to make a translation, and it takes some thinking to make this translation most closely fit (your view of) the spirit of the original. Players will compare it with the original, whereas original creations will be judged solely on its own merits. Copying some visuals or gameplay can be really tricky. Why would I want to make something exactly the same as the original, when I can do something BETTER? When I could put my own twist, or at least make it LOOK different from the original? I think it's a bit presumptuous to think just any LBP creator can do better than a professional game company. To take your example, if the different look would have improved the original, most likely the company would already have used that look to begin with. Also, to me it feels dishonest, like you're trying to hide that you are copying something. And it's not like slapping some new visuals or names on something is very original. In fact, it seems almost lazy, as making a good copy can be a lot harder (see my response to Keldur above). It also depends on your goals with a level. If your goal is to make a stealth game, you focus on making the best stealth gameplay you can think of, but if your goal is to make a Metal Gear tribute, you focus on copying the stealth gameplay as closely as possible. But either goal seems entirely valid to me. To conclude, I understand the sentiment behind the first post, and I'm all for creating original stuff, but I'm afraid it's just like in the game development world: players verge to the familiar, so creators will cater to that. Btw, Macme: I was going to thank you, but then you insulted improvisational jazz. I would still like to see a LBP version of Talisman, though. I considered making something like Rune Master, it's a bit similar. Have you played that?

2010-09-08 13:16:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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& I was about to thank you... then I noticed you were defending Improvisational Jazz!!! Jazz is a four letter word in my household & Yes, I've played Rune Master... that sounds like it'd also be a pretty big LBP2 challenge

2010-09-08 15:29:00 Author: Macnme Posts: 1970

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I'm fine with some LBP recreations... but not the spammed ones... I'd like to see a Shift in LBP2... I wouldn't mind... I liek making recreations if they aren't obvious (take Shift for example), but I don't publish them, rather than just gloat to my friends

2010-09-08 18:59:00 Author: Unknown User

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& I was about to thank you... then I noticed you were defending Improvisational Jazz!!! Jazz is a four letter word in my household & Yes, I've played Rune Master... that sounds like it'd also be a pretty big LBP2 challenge I'm pretty sure Jazz is a four letter word in every household.

2010-09-09 02:17:00 Author: Moony Posts: 368

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