Archive: 43 posts

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This is a prototype of a top-down bipedal mech in LBP. It can torso-twist, turn in place (albeit slowly), walk forward and backward, and even walk while turning slightly. To control it, just use the left analog stick to move the nav cursor (glowing spot). The mech will automatically turn towards the cursor and walk towards it when it is moved far enough away. Properly directing the mech takes some getting used to. In this small showcase level you can block traffic, attempt to navigate between the buildings, knock down fences and shoot at things (though nothing is set up to explode on being shot). Enjoy. http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17270 http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17269 http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17268

2010-05-22 06:11:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Object showcase is just full of mechs all of a sudden. Looks good from the screenshots. When I get time I'll try it out and then tell you how mine is so much better.... I mean tell you what I think of it.

2010-05-22 06:22:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Well I figured I might as well jump on the bandwagon. After all, I have a reputation to uphold... or something.

2010-05-22 06:25:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Finally got around to trying it. It's awesome! The animation and sound effects really sold it: I felt like it was actually walking. The cars beeping at me were hilarious. I kept wishing I could stomp on them but I had to settle for kicking them around. The control scheme was a bit difficult to use, but I figure it's about the best you can get with lbp1. Using a directional sack tracker is genius: I can't think of any other way of driving a mech on the back wall (until, y'know, we get dcs's). The mech and the background could both use a lot more detail, but I imagine you just haven't got around to it yet (the whole beta thing). I would use thack and thick materials to get slightly different depths (the effect is subtle but when you're building top-down and you've only got 3 layers to work with it can make a big difference--did you notice that I use thack parts embedded into thick parts all over the place on my mech?) Maybe even use the 50 layer glitch to get an extra foreground layer for details or whatever (the background layers collide with the back thin layer, but the foreground layers don't collide with the front thin layer, so you can basically get a whole 'nother layer for free).

2010-05-22 22:50:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Ive played it today,its a awesome level,i just wish i could destroy the cars

2010-05-22 23:13:00 Author: corey2788 Posts: 21

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Thanks for the feedback! Yeah the mech is not very detailed. It's pretty much just the first prototype top-down mech I made, to which I added a bit of a paint job and a proper nav cursor. I had to redesign the legs more than a few times to solve the problem of getting the thing to walk and turn, so that's why I didn't bother to put too much detail. Even now there's still an unsolved issue regarding the added weight of the mech's top half, which is only partially solved with a block of peach floaty (not an ideal solution). Making a top-down vehicle that is not on a rail, pistons or rockets means it's highly susceptible to gravity, which should be solved once LBP2 rolls around and I can get my hands on that gravity control! The control is not actually a sack tracker. There's a magnetic key on the nav cursor which multiple switches on the mech use to determine the movement mode and facing (a simple-looking, yet complex piece of logic). Ideally I want to allow multiple mechs at once, which is why I couldn't use a sack tracker. Each mech would have their own colored key. The top half of the mech itself is actually in the glitch layers. Only the legs are on the regular layers, and the background occupies the middle thick layer because I wanted to block out the jetpack's smoke. Not having to rely on a hidden jetpack in LBP2 means I'll be able to shift the entire contraption back one thick layer and use the theck and thack layers (since I don't know how to get them into the extra layers). I made the background just to have a point of reference to how the mech was moving. I thought just having a big block of one material would be too boring which is why I made roads and sidewalks. Just having the mech walk around with nothing in the way would also not be a good test, so I put in buildings to navigate around and some simple cars for fun. I'm also disappointed the cars can't be crushed, but there's technical limitations for that. I'll definitely look for a way to make this happen in LBP2.

2010-05-22 23:35:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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a top-down vehicle that is not on a rail, pistons or rockets ???? Really? How'd you pull that off? There's a magnetic key on the nav cursor... Each mech would have their own colored key. Ah, of course. That makes much more sense than a sack tracker. The top half of the mech itself is actually in the glitch layers. Only the legs are on the regular layers, and the background occupies the middle thick layer because I wanted to block out the jetpack's smoke. Not having to rely on a hidden jetpack in LBP2 means I'll be able to shift the entire contraption back one thick layer and use the theck and thack layers (since I don't know how to get them into the extra layers). Oh, right. I should've figured that out. For some reason it slipped my mind that sackboy would take up a layer. As for theck and thack, you can't get theck into the glitch layers.... well, you can, but it's very temperamental. If you select it, it'll pop back into the front layer. The same thing happens when you capture it and emit it. I sorta managed it with the lightning bolts on my mech (the front thin layer was blocked so I made 'em theck and moved 'em into the foreground), but I had to cheat a bit: I captured the lightning along with a 4-layer deep tiny block of gas, set the emitter to fire it, and then moved it back a layer so it would trick it into emitting into the foreground. Fortunately, the gas is tiny, is pretty far from the cockpit, and has a .1 sec lifetime so there shouldn't be any problem with it killing anybody. I think thack works fine in the glitch layers. I'd have to test to be sure, but I'm pretty sure the burnt out VT-4 that I stuck in the background of the VT-4 level has thack parts that didn't pop when I selected it (the theck parts did, though, so once I emitted it into the bg, I couldn't touch it). As I said, there's a subtle difference in thickness between thack and thick that can be used to give a subtle amount of depth difference to objects, though it's easier to see when the camera is angled a bit. Speaking of which, it might be cool to add camera angles to your mech. When the cursor is above the mech, the camera can move up a bit and angle back to give a better view of what's above the mech, and so on for the other directions. If you have more than one camera object active at a time, it averages their angles, so you could probably get some decent diagonal angles as well. Hm... just tested it and it... sorta' works. Unfortunately, it seems to draw a line to from the focal point to sackboy and when you average the two together, it places the focal point where those two lines intersect... which is where sackboy is. So it works alright for angle, but not that great for focal points. Maybe it's not that great of an idea. [edit] I'm so stupid: I forgot to disable player tracking. It actually does work pretty good.

2010-05-23 01:30:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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???? Really? How'd you pull that off?[...] A small piece of dark matter is emitted in a hole in the center of the feet. This keeps the mech from falling off and also simulates the feet resting on the ground. When the mech moves, the emitter on the foot that is moving is turned off, allowing the foot to move forward or backward freely. This is what allows the mech to move despite relying on dark matter. In a sense the mech does actually walk, though I suppose it would be more accurate to say that it climbs.

2010-05-23 02:24:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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I have to try out this level later XD

2010-05-23 03:29:00 Author: Arnald23 Posts: 1843

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I guess that explains why the added weight at the top was a bad thing. It seems to struggle a bit when you're turning and it gets hung up on corners really easily, but otherwise it works great. I didn't give the control system enough credit in my previous comment: once I got the hang of it, it actually worked great. I was impressed by the fact that it could walk backwards as well. Not that it's especially difficult, I suppose, but the fact that it was smart enough to know when to do it was impressive.

2010-05-23 03:35:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Why does the sackboy have to be so far away before the mech starts walking? Is a distance longer than the mech itself really necessary? Oh well, truly ingenuous concept! I would have never thought anything like this was possible. Great work!

2010-05-23 05:52:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Thanks for the feedback! The reason the mech doesn't instantly move is because I wanted to allow a small area where the mech stands still and only the torso turns to aim at things nearby. If I could force the camera object to zoom out further, I would have allowed the cursor to move out further as well. When LBP2 rolls along, I'll probably be abandoning the nav cursor in favor of giving direct control over the mech's movement and torso-twisting (Can't wait!!!).

2010-05-23 14:55:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Cool beans. Will definitely check this out when I get back from NYC. It's awesome you've taken another perspective with it. ^^

2010-05-23 20:21:00 Author: gevurah22 Posts: 1476

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Woooaahh... That defies the laws of amazing...

2010-05-25 03:18:00 Author: JspOt Posts: 3607

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Hmm! RTS status. aha the level was cool

2010-07-12 22:53:00 Author: nowblink Posts: 105

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O: Wow, talk about original. Sure, Mechs in LBP do look pretty cool, but they can only be viewed from the sides. ): But a mech that you can view from the top? I gotta say, this is pretty sweet!

2010-07-14 07:39:00 Author: Mastadom Posts: 195

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Thanks! It's still pretty rough (it is only a prototype after all), but I'm confident I'll be able to turn this concept into something epic once LBP2 rolls along. I don't think I'll turn it into a series like I'm doing with SackMech currently, but probably make some kind of 4 player versus level, with the option of putting "bots" as well.

2010-07-14 12:03:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Finally a unique mech in LBP (There are tooooo many mechs that are pretty much the same.) Thanks for sharing!

2010-07-17 16:41:00 Author: AbstractFlesh Posts: 837

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Wow! amazing job, this is a very innovative idea.

2010-07-21 03:30:00 Author: ferrrch Posts: 429

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is there any chance you chould show us the logic and how it works? the turning s amazing, but cars keep stopping me! :/ wonderful level though. his walking sequence is awesome too.

2010-07-22 13:31:00 Author: septamus112 Posts: 82

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is there any chance you chould show us the logic and how it works? the turning s amazing, but cars keep stopping me! :/ wonderful level though. his walking sequence is awesome too. Well, the logic and mechanism is actually kind of sloppy since it's just the first version of the mech I've managed to make. Since I've recently gotten some glitched floaty, I might be able to remake the entire mech using it to fix the weight issues. That would also be a good time to rework the logic from scratch into something more presentable and manageable.

2010-07-22 14:11:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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This was really fun to play! Sometimes the mech felt a little unresponsive but maybe that was just my lack of skill.

2010-07-22 15:38:00 Author: Ayneh Posts: 2454

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Finally got to play it yesterday. Very very sweet and trust me, LBP2 will treat your creations kindly. =) Aside from that, the tracking mechanism you used was very interesting in order to make it twist and turn. Good stuff! Ever think about making a "scaled down" version in regards to size in order to get more out of what's on the screen and maybe using the circle function to add another action into it (which btw I can no longer make my mecha's without)?

2010-07-22 16:39:00 Author: gevurah22 Posts: 1476

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Well, i just tried to recreate it... didnt work.. mine can only go up and turn its head and even those dont work very well. I'm very interested to see how it works. is it dark matter emmited into the foot, then a pisten pulling up the body on each leg? cuz i tried and i couldnt do it right. Anyway, this is the best mech i have seen in LBP so far, can't wait to see the final version :]

2010-07-22 17:30:00 Author: septamus112 Posts: 82

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The feet are indeed pushed on pistons, with a bit of dark matter being emitted in a slot in them. In order to make the mech turn, the legs are rotated slightly from the hip by using wobble bolts. You should be able to see the leg rotation clearly if you just make the mech turn in place by placing the nav cursor off to the sides. The major complexity of the logic comes from this simple movement, because the leg needs to be rotated in and out at the same rhythm as the piston, and it varies depending on whether the mech has to turn left, right, or walk straight (there is also an additional layer of complexity because the mech can walk backwards and turn while walking).

2010-07-22 18:26:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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ok, at least i figure one thing right btw are the legs turned with a logic switch or just with prox on the sides? Cuz i can (not really but a little bit) make it turn while moving with prox, but only to one side. And if it is a logic switch, which one? logic is my week point so i really wanna learn.

2010-07-22 22:18:00 Author: septamus112 Posts: 82

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Found this absolutely amazing. Who would have thought you could defy gravity as smoothly as this, without pistons or rails? (Unless you count the dark matter in the foot as a rail of sorts, but then the whole thing would have been impossible anyway) Great work, and I can't wait til what you can manage when given LBP2 tools.

2010-07-23 02:34:00 Author: Rhombohedron Posts: 25

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wow thats cool but i had thoght it would look like a sackperson kinda misled there

2010-09-20 03:03:00 Author: endgame Posts: 70

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Looks cool!!! Ill give it a try when i get home!!

2010-09-20 03:04:00 Author: shadow3596 Posts: 2442

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My god, when first saw this, i thought you had gotten a hacked version of LBP2. I love it so much, and i'm definitely going to check this out later.

2010-09-21 00:46:00 Author: kodymcq Posts: 281

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Nice I also made such a mech a year ago but I was too lazy to work on the level. If anyone remembers the Fuchikoma level I made, I wanted to do the same thing with that mech and I already have a working model but I wasn't happy with the energy bar. I don't know how to make enemies damage your mech no matter where they hit you. Did you make yours damageable? However I should try your mech when I'm on later.

2010-09-22 10:16:00 Author: Chrree Posts: 554

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No, it's not damageable. There are no enemies in the level; it's just a prototype for the walking motion. It shouldn't be very hard detecting harmful projectiles around your mech though. My other mechs simply use a magnetic key switch which detects a specific key color that is attached to all enemy projectiles. That is a simple way to go about it, or the "hit box" could be spread with multiple smaller magnetic key switches connected to an OR switch. If not, you could also make it so the enemy projectiles somehow emit their key only when they come into contact with your mech (such as by using plasma balls) for more precision.

2010-09-22 13:19:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Glad to hear that the SackMech program is going on smooth and sound, should be an awesome turnout when Gilgamesh gets his little paws on teh Direct Control Seat. I am anxiously awating the arrival of a new breed of mechas, the "SackMech", I would offer my services as a promotionaly sack, get a tatoo on my forehead or something. If you need anythings like custome stickers or such, hook me up dude.

2010-09-22 15:32:00 Author: damaz10 Posts: 771

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Well, after seeing some of what LBP2 is actually capable of (and because I have to step up my game due to increasing competition, hehe), I've greatly expanded my ideas for what SackMech 2.0 should be. The gears have been turning non-stop. If I manage to fit in every feature I want (and I'm thinking of more every day), SackMech 2.0 should turn out to be the single most advanced top-down mech level that will ever be made in LBP2. That's a bold claim to make, but I *am* thinking of ideas that are just *that* crazy. Anxiously waiting on LBP2 now.

2010-09-22 16:44:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Thank you I never thought of that. o.O That would be really an improvement because I was using something like shield till now. Don't be so sure your mech will be the best one on LBP2 because you still have to compete with me! xD

2010-09-22 16:51:00 Author: Chrree Posts: 554

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I have to step up my game due to increasing competition, hehe Um.... who would that be? SackMech 2.0 should turn out to be the single most advanced top-down mech level that will ever be made in LBP2. Oh it's on now!

2010-09-22 17:04:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Um.... who would that be? Oh it's on now! Haha, well there was you and donkey_show, and now apparently Chrree is joining the fray. I don't think celteen or dr-booty are planning top-down mechs, but they might be. And who knows if any of the other LBP mech makers are quietly plotting something. I do have my work cut out for me.

2010-09-22 17:53:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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Things will certainly get interesting in lbp2. Up until now, my strengths have been my control systems, my stabilizers, and my understanding of the relationships between object mass and connector strength (pretty much every time somebody asked me for help on a mech, I went in and changed materials and sizes of parts to make everything stronger). All of that will be obsolete in lbp2: I'm not going to have any better mastery of a controllinator, gyroscope, or mover than the next guy. I suppose a lot of it will come down to style (compare my mechs to others like yours or Ayneh's and you see that style is NOT one of my strong points). Of course there's still logic, which I'm pretty good at, and then from what I read in the contraption contest over on the lbp2 beta forum, it seems that the concept of user friendly controls is completely foreign to a lot of people, so I should do well with that. But then of course, there's the fact that a lot of people who would have shied away from the near impossible task of mech building in lbp will take it up now that the major problems have been solved for us in lbp2. You seem to know a lot more mech builders than I do, but I guess I never paid much attention to who built them other than the exceptional ones. Also, I wouldn't say that Gevurah's mechs really fit into the same category as ours (good thing too, 'cuz I wouldn't wanna' go up against him.... though I guess I kinda' did with Starfighter (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=21545-Flying-spaceship-with-near-perfect-control-Starfighter)--I don't think I won that competition ).

2010-09-22 21:08:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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[...]Also, I wouldn't say that Gevurah's mechs really fit into the same category as ours (good thing too, 'cuz I wouldn't wanna' go up against him.... though I guess I kinda' did with Starfighter (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=21545-Flying-spaceship-with-near-perfect-control-Starfighter)--I don't think I won that competition ). Have you seen this video of his beta armorboy level? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hnvfiT9WZI But yes, all of the new, easier tools in LBP2 mean that simply making a mech that works (whether in top-down or normal view) is not going to be enough to be impressive. It's part of the reason I've been letting my imagination run wild without worrying about whether it's too much to cram into a single level. It will be interesting to see what LBP2 will bring to the table (if the beta community videos are anything to go by).

2010-09-23 05:03:00 Author: Gilgamesh Posts: 2536

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what you do in LBP2 will be interesting, I don't think I got round to (forgot) reply on this thread, I've played this level and I remember it since, it was good fun. are you going to make top-down mechs or side-view mechs on LBP2?

2010-09-23 05:56:00 Author: huntedstorm Posts: 488

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I dunno about Gilgamesh, but I'll be doing a top down one AND a side view one, if for no other reason than to finally be able to build a mech with perfect controls/responsiveness. beta armorboy level Wow! Every time I see something from the beta, I get all jealous. I could be building pinball machines, mechs, flying contraptions (for the beta contraption contest), or whatever, but I can't cuz I'm still waiting for my code: I just get to see all these other guys do it (though, as I said before, I doubt I could compete with Gev even if I were in the beta now). One thing that really bothers me about Gev's vehicles, though, is it seems impossible to avoid taking damage. I've always figured that, in any game, if you're good enough, it should be possible to avoid taking damage (and that's the main reason I never finished a proper level for any of my mechs: there just wasn't a good way to dodge or block attacks).

2010-09-23 07:53:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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I played your level and I really like your ideas. To control the mech with a pointer instead of controlling the mech directly is very creative and gives you a different feeling. The animations are very good aswell but I had some trouble to maneuver it. Sometimes I had the feeling that the mech did the opposite of what I wanted it to do.

2010-09-23 17:53:00 Author: Chrree Posts: 554

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I dunno about Gilgamesh, but I'll be doing a top down one AND a side view one, if for no other reason than to finally be able to build a mech with perfect controls/responsiveness. Wow! Every time I see something from the beta, I get all jealous. I could be building pinball machines, mechs, flying contraptions (for the beta contraption contest), or whatever, but I can't cuz I'm still waiting for my code: I just get to see all these other guys do it (though, as I said before, I doubt I could compete with Gev even if I were in the beta now). One thing that really bothers me about Gev's vehicles, though, is it seems impossible to avoid taking damage. I've always figured that, in any game, if you're good enough, it should be possible to avoid taking damage (and that's the main reason I never finished a proper level for any of my mechs: there just wasn't a good way to dodge or block attacks). I want to get into the beta too, most of my friends are at it like crazy as if they were some sort of zombies!! and i have to stick to lbp or other games, btw, why so many videos and stuff from the beta, aren't they supposed to have an NDA agreement? or do we can start to disclose beta stuff like crazy now???? btw Awesome mech gilgamesh, its epic, ive played that level before and its a quite unique piece for the lbp mech community creations! with a very good implemented walking system.

2010-09-23 23:06:00 Author: Ragnarok Posts: 898

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