Archive: 42 posts

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I just noticed that the bottom half of the pod is tweakable (let's you tweak the color/brightness/etc of the headlights). I'm sure others have noticed that by now, and that's NOT why I started this thread, but thought it was worth pointing out to anybody who hasn't noticed it yet. Now, onto the the real point of the thread. I noticed that the pod sections, which occupy the thick layer are divided into sub layers: it's got a theck (checkpoint thick) back, a thack (sackboy thick) middle, and a thock* front. You can use thack glass to make windows and have them overlap inside of the top half of the pod: you can even corner edit them while they're overlapping (normally you can't corner edit theck or thack objects when they're overlapping each other). Well, that's nifty, but being who I am, I decided to see how I could break it. First I broke the theck part: I made a theck metal object, set the pod piece on top of it, and then made another above it with a huge weight attached and gently pushed it into the pod until I heard a crack and the pod fell to the ground. So far so good: I've reduced it to the thack and thock layers (it still looks solid because 3d meshes in video games are separate from their collision models). Next since this is the first time I've ever observed something occupying the thock layer, I decided to try to smash it too. Unfortunately, there are no thock objects to smash it, so I experimented a bit. There was a glitch discovered some time ago where you could shift objects from layer to layer and have them end up between layers (click L3 to copy the object, then shift it from one layer to another and at almost the same time, hit X to place it. It'll end up partly in one layer and partly in another. Don't select it or it'll pop back into a normal layer). Next I made another copy and placed it in a normal layer and lined it up with the other one so that the thock parts were overlapped. Then I selected the misaligned pod, which popped it back into a normal layer: meaning the thock parts were now occupying the same space. When I tried to move it: crack! The thock layer was gone and I had a wholly thack pod piece. Sackboy can pass through the front and back walls of it like they're not there. I probably find all of this more interesting than anybody else because I'm all about the sub-layers. I thought it was worth mentioning because this is the first time I've ever confirmed the existence of the thock layer (though I suppose the tea cup object must use it too). * thock is the name Aya gave the front sub-layer after I pointed its existence out to him. In his words: "That ought to drive Rtm crazy." I use it here for lack of a better term, but mostly as a joke. If anybody can think of a better/more logical name for it, go for it. For those who have never noticed: set a thack object right beside a thick object and turn the camera to the side. You'll notice that the thack object is thinner on the back AND the front, which was what led me to believe the thock layer existed in the first place. [EDIT] I'm fairly certain now, that the front of the pod is NOT actually the thock layer, not does it confirm that a thock layer material could be possible. The reason for this is that thecX-men can pass through theck layer materials and checkpoints (which are the only known naturally occurring objects), but they can't pass through the back of the incredibles pod, teacup, etc. This suggests that, though it's similar and in roughly the same place as the theck layer, it's not exactly the same, in which case, the front wouldn't be exactly the same as thock. So yeah, I'm thinking that stable, editable thock layer material isn't possible.

2010-05-04 09:57:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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I thought it was worth mentioning because this is the first time I've ever confirmed the existence of the thock layer (though I suppose the tea cup object must use it too). Certainly interesting, but is it of any practical use? What I was kinda hoping for was a way to place materials which only occupy the 'thock' layer, much like you can with theck/thack. I have a nasty feeling that if it were possible, they'd pop back into some other layers when selected. thock is the name Aya gave the front sub-layer after I pointed its existence out to him. In his words: "That ought to drive Rtm crazy." Heh. Any excuse to come up with another stupid name to give rtm something new to rant about. I hereby coin the term "horse glitch" as an alternative to "cow glitch".

2010-05-04 13:29:00 Author: Aya042 Posts: 2870

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:eek: thock? heh heh... this is pretty interesting. for starters, i didn't know about tweaking the lights and now thock? there's got to be a way of getting a material in there. others may not agree, but i can see great potential in a thock layer, particually in conjunction with theck and thack.

2010-05-04 16:06:00 Author: trip090 Posts: 1562

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Slightly confused as to what you mean, but neat

2010-05-04 16:35:00 Author: Matimoo Posts: 1027

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i can see great potential in a thock layer, particually in conjunction with theck and thack. Indeed. I hope somebody is able to find a way to reproduce it, but I'm pretty sure it would have to be a completely new method. The old method for making theck and thack was patched, so even if we could isolate a thock object, we couldn't use it to make thock materials. The new method uses thickness changing, but when you change to thin, it goes from front to back: to make thock, presumably you'd need it to go from back to front when thinning. I hereby coin the term "horse glitch" as an alternative to "cow glitch". Nooooo! I already hate that everybody calls it "cow glitch" instead of "material glitch" or "material properties glitch" (which is what we called it back when it was first discovered.

2010-05-04 19:04:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Can't wait til somebody discovers thuck... sounds so funny.

2010-05-04 19:12:00 Author: KQuinn94Z Posts: 1758

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yeah...that will be great.

2010-05-04 19:30:00 Author: trip090 Posts: 1562

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So it's as thick as a sock? I certainly hope it's "sock" and not something else! I was chuckling at the name before I saw the footnote, I just think it's sweet that I'm always at the front of your thoughts Aya However I don't really have anything to add until it's reproducible Nice find though.

2010-05-04 19:33:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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alright! here's the deal. whoever makes thock material, completely stable and editable, will get this as a reward: http://czechmatediary.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/chocolate_chip_cookie.jpg A giant, buttery, chocolaty, sweet, chewy cookie. so moist, so succulent and oh so tasty, no, deliciously scrumptious, that you will explode with pleasure. so what you waiting for, go get that thock!

2010-05-04 19:42:00 Author: trip090 Posts: 1562

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So it's as thick as a sock? I certainly hope it's "sock" and not something else! Maybe it's as thick as a flock. Like a flock of.... I dunno.... seagulls or something. Hummingbirds? They don't flock, but they should. How cool would a flock of hummingbirds be? A clock! It's as thick as a clock. 'Cuz, you know, clocks are thin and only take up the front layer of.... yeah, I got nothing. I would like to have it available for materials, but I doubt it's possible. I'll do some experiments later, though: might be able to use the glitch that lets you move things in between layers, but I doubt it'll lead to anything stable.

2010-05-04 20:04:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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If you turn the camera to the side, normal theck, thack, and thin layers fir together perfectly. How would a thock fit?

2010-05-04 20:50:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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If you turn the camera to the side, normal theck, thack, and thin layers fir together perfectly. How would a thock fit? im not actually sure, although i see what you mean.

2010-05-04 21:07:00 Author: trip090 Posts: 1562

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If you turn the camera to the side, normal theck, thack, and thin layers fir together perfectly. How would a thock fit? They don't actually. Are you talking about a thin layer in front of a thack layer? There's a noticeable gap between them. Another thing you can do is set a thack object right beside a thick one. Turn the camera to the side and you'll notice that the thack one is missing a bit of material in the front AND the back. If it helps, you can use a camera object turned as far to the side as possible and then put in a magic mouth with cutscene camer and turn that as far to the side as possible. When you trigger both, you'll get an even more sideways view and you should be able to clearly see the space between the thack and thin objects.

2010-05-04 22:33:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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abgth, what? They found ANOTHER layer?! Gah, just how many layers are there?! Next you're gonna find thick an thck and theck and thoueack and whatnot! I'm wondering if there are more hidden layers or bomb survivals. lol, well, as long as this gives more opportunities to build over w/out deletion objects behind, then i say, bring it!

2010-05-04 22:56:00 Author: Silverleon Posts: 6707

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whoever makes thock material, completely stable and editable You had to throw stable and editable in there, didn't you. It's easy enough to stick a thin layer object into the thock layer, but getting it to stay there seems to be impossible. Once you select it or try to edit it, it pops back into a thin layer.

2010-05-04 22:58:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Heheh... I was wondering when, or if thock and thuck would ever be discovered... Sounds interesting. I, being able to recreate almost any glitch, given a half an hour, should check this out! ...I just need the Incredibles kit...

2010-05-05 00:00:00 Author: KlawwTheClown Posts: 1106

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Try this: put some thin layer in thock(make sure its really big) and cover the edges with bombs. See where im getting at? then you copy it into popit, and place it. If it works, I officially name it: Deviantgeek is awesome!

2010-05-22 14:28:00 Author: Deviantgeek Posts: 386

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Shameless, bump. I really want someone to make this work.

2010-05-24 22:02:00 Author: Deviantgeek Posts: 386

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If someone discovers another layer, we're going to run out of vowels and be forced to name it "thuck". At this point, rtm and I will no doubt scream something along the lines of, "Thuck this! I'm going home where we have VALUES and name things well!"

2010-05-25 02:44:00 Author: KablooieKablam Posts: 364

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It's as thick as a... erm... nevermind. :blush:

2010-05-25 03:41:00 Author: Frinklebumper Posts: 941

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If someone discovers another layer, we're going to run out of vowels Thawk (hawk) Theek (creak) Thuck (muck) Thook (hook) Thohk (stroke) Thahk (clock) Theyek (hike) Thewk (puke) Thoyck (toy...ck) Therk (Turk) Thork (fork) Thark (bark) Theerk (beer...ck)

2010-05-25 04:49:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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I appreciate it, Incinerator, I really do. But those aren't vowels And jeez, if we find that many layers, I quit. Also, can someone post a picture of Thock?

2010-05-25 07:25:00 Author: KablooieKablam Posts: 364

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There's no pictures because we haven't been able to create anything that's really thock. I'll have to try that bomb idea, though. I did manage to isolate a stable but useless thock layer object last night. I noticed that when I creature brain killed a gassed teacup, it left the invisible theck and thock parts behind. Of course, I couldn't keep them from disappearing, so I did a rollback to version 1.02. I wasn't able to keep the thock part from disappearing at that point, but I found that I could layer pop the theck part into the thock layer and it was stable (I could select it without it popping back to its normal layer, and I could layer shift it to the other two thock layers). I updated to 1.18 and for some reason the game seemed to decide that my dead cup parts weren't dead any more so they didn't dissapear, which meant I had the theck and thock parts. I was able to push away the theck part and keep the thock part, though as far as I could tell, it was identical to the theck part that I had layer popped. Sorry, that was probably boring to read. Anyway, the next thing I thought I'd try was to use the old theck method (where we used checkpoints to make it) to try to make thock. Unfortunately, the glitch didn't exist in version 1.02 of the game and had been patched before 1.18, so I was unsuccessful. The only option left would be if somebody had a ps3 system backup that included lbp gamedata with a patch when the glitch worked. I know a guy who has such a back-up so I'll have to talk to him... but I'm not optimistic about success. I'm thinking the theck portion of the hollow objects (teacup, potc mug, incredibles pod, etc) has different properties from the normal checkpoint style theck items.

2010-05-25 21:33:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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I know a guy who has such a back-up so I'll have to talk to him... makes him sound like some black marketeer. i'm really keen to get thock material. i actually found it all interesting to read.i'm probably no help though with this though. anyway, i'm almost positive that thock isn't impossible to make. i've mucked about and it seems possible.

2010-05-25 22:27:00 Author: trip090 Posts: 1562

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Sevhen it looks like the cookie is yours. Can you update a photo when it is stable/editable?

2010-07-12 09:01:00 Author: Strangepom Posts: 445

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I'm sure he'd do it if he found a way, but after many months, no progress has been made

2010-07-12 11:13:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Right. The one thing that I was able to stably put into the thock layer was invisible, uneditable (it was the part of the teacup), and dead (killed it with a creature brain) and it couldn't be used to make thock material in the way that the checkpoint could be used to make theck. It was a novelty, but a completely useless one. Anyway, I'm thinking that the back section of the monorail pod and the teacup aren't theck... at least not exactly. They're in the same part of the layer and they can pass between a thin layer and a thack layer, but they behave differently. There are people who can slip through theck objects, but they can't slip through the back of a teacup. Also, you can't corner edit a thack material when it overlaps a theck one, but you can corner edit a thack material when it's inside the monorail pod (that's how I made the windows for my Incredible Car (https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=26340-Incredible-car)).

2010-07-13 22:24:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Hey Sehven, Yeah I've noticed that layer too. I first noticed it when the Pirates of The Caribbean came out, its on the barrel cup thing. But more importantly you might like to know, I have accidently made it a few times. It was when my friend first found out the still possible way to make Theck/Thack (I hate them names btw lol, I call them Check Point/Golf Ball). We made it several times, at the time we just thought it was Theck in the foreground ?3D? layer so never saved because at that particular time I didn?t know that Theck placed in the back/foreground pops back to the game play layers once selected. So I thought it was useless at the time, I could have easily recreate it. I have tried making it a lot ever since, and with no luck. I don't know if its been patched... or I was just lucky at the time

2010-07-16 11:09:00 Author: oLMCo Posts: 96

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It's probably been patched right along with the theck and thack layers (the old way of making them, that it). I'm not even sure if the glitch patches are always deliberate: if you go back to earlier versions of lbp, a lot of the glitches didn't work. They were introduced by a patch and then removed by another patch. Out of curiosity, what specifically did you do that made it happen?

2010-07-16 19:16:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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You know the way to still make Theck and Thack right? I've shown you lol. Any way, its when you change the thickness of a block of material and quickly place before it reaches the correct size. It doesn?t instantly change from a thin layer to a thick then to two thick, theres and animation or process between it changing and if you place it at that time the block will be that thickness. There are hundreds of possible layers when doing that but if their not the size of any of the known game play layers (thin, thick, theck or thack) then it will automatically pop back to the closes one when selected. I can easily make theck and thack by using this technique. Its not any trouble at all, just as easy as placing a block of material, I normally get it first time every time. It saves carrying blocks of materials around that can get a glitched texture from being resized so much. You can also make other glitched materials Theck/Thack, like grabable Theck Pink Floaty that looks like Cardboard for example. So yeah any way, the way I accidently made this new layer was by using the technique above, but placing layers through each other. I just went crazy really, making a block with about 20-30 different layers through each other. When I then selected it they then popped back to the correct layers (thin, 1 thick, 2 thick, 3 thick, theck, thack and the new layer). This was like almost a year or so ago now when my friend first found that trick to making any layer (was hemflowhotflop btw, so all credit to him) And at the time we didn?t think it was anything special, we just thought it was Theck in the fore ground. Only after trying to emit some Theck into the fore ground, I found out that it pops back to the 3 main layers, so it would have been useful after all. Have tried to recreate it many times after that, but as I said no luck. I cant see it being patched because the trick I stated above still works for recreating Theck/Thack.

2010-07-19 14:26:00 Author: oLMCo Posts: 96

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Nice Finds, and very interesting indeed.

2010-08-01 11:37:00 Author: Raduban Posts: 23

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No news news on this? any luck sehven? I think my disk has the original way of making the sublayer if I put it back to it's original non patched state, if needed. (Yes, I really want this sublayer!)

2010-08-11 04:06:00 Author: Fishrock123 Posts: 1578

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I haven't tried in a while. I'll experiment with what oLMCo said and see if I have any luck. If you think you can pull it off with a rollback, then by all means, go for it.

2010-08-14 10:47:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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Are you sure that you couldn't make this thock layer in the 1.02 patch of the game? If the teacup was there at the time perhaps it was possible using the method oLMCo said. Or maybe even another method.

2010-08-14 17:47:00 Author: goldenclaw13 Posts: 224

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oh now i know where it fits in front of thack oh i discovered another sub-layer check it out on LBL forums http://www.littlebigland.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4558 I WANT THAT COOKIE

2010-09-04 04:55:00 Author: Cades99 Posts: 7

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i think a logical name for them would be s.l.1.t s.l.2.t and s.l.3.t (shifted layer 1 third, shifted layer 2 thirds, and shifted layer 3 thirds,) who agrees with me?

2010-09-12 04:58:00 Author: endgame Posts: 70

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Has there been any progress on this? It would be cool to have another layer. This guy on PSN gave me a piece of material he claims to be Thock. I'm not 100% sure how to tell. He got it from the fan platform object out of the islands theme. It is invisible, uneditable, can only be selected with the box. Not sure if this helps, but I figured I'd add it anyway.

2010-11-11 23:15:00 Author: Kitkasumass Posts: 494

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I've seen objects like that. It's essentially the same as the front part of the teacup that I managed to extract once, but it didn't lead to a way to make thock materials. I'm pretty sure at this point that there's no way to make thock material. The closest we've come is layer-popping thin or theck material into the thock part of the layer, but it's unstable--as soon as you select it, it pops back to a normal layer.

2010-11-12 09:55:00 Author: Sehven Posts: 2188

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So, thock is impossible to make stable and uneditable at the moment.

2011-07-04 16:16:00 Author: Unknown User

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i got a thock layer in my goodies bag > you can put a thin and theck layer in the front of it, and it will fit, if you arranged three of thock layers in a row from the front to back layer and compare it to thick and thack, theres a bigger gap with thock, you can pretty much add more detail with this layer. i have the material as a cardboard block and it fits inside the incredibles top hull perfectly http://i1195.photobucket.com/albums/aa399/STOOPIDSMX/3.jpg http://s1195.photobucket.com/albums/aa399/STOOPIDSMX/?action=view¤t=2.jpg http://s1195.photobucket.com/albums/aa399/STOOPIDSMX/?action=view¤t=1.jpg

2011-07-14 23:15:00 Author: Unknown User

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i got a thock layer in my goodies bag... http://i1195.photobucket.com/albums/aa399/STOOPIDSMX/2.jpg Looks like plain old thack to me. If that were the theoretical thock layer, it'd be thinner, and there'd be no gap between it, and the thin layer in front.

2011-07-15 00:39:00 Author: Aya042 Posts: 2870

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Then if its not thock its not thack either,You can fit theck on both,front and back of the material,And its thinner than thack

2011-07-16 03:19:00 Author: Unknown User

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