Archive: 20 posts

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Warning: Wall of Text commencing. Hello. I run a clan called Therium, which has over 70 members. The clan is about creating online with others. Up to this point, it has been running fine.. But some people are starting to behave very childish and we need to kick them out. But there's a huge problem with this. But before I ask the main question, let me explain how the system in Therium works: In Therium, there are Admins, Leaders, and Team Leaders. The Admins have complete control over Therium, and the Leaders can let new members in. To let a new member in, they have a Leader Key, which is a special sticker. Here is an example of how they let a member in: Imagine, a person wants to join. We evaluate him, based on his levels and his friendliness. If he passes, we go into the Joining Level with him, which opens only to our Leaders. the Leader uses his Key to give the new member all his stuff (Therium Key, and a Therium Space (a personal level to express him/herself in that only Therium members have access to). The Leader adds the person to the member list and invites him to the PSN chat. Once the person is in Therium, they get access to a LOT of Therium Spaces (about every member has one, that makes about 70 therium spaces currently). Some of these Therium Spaces are works of art, which makes for fine premium content for our members. Now we get to the main question: Once this person is in Therium, he/she has the Therium Key, which grants him/her access to the Therium Spaces and the official Therium Levels. But LBP doesn't have a button to take away stickers from members. So, to kick them out, we would need to create a new sticker, and make it so that the levels only work with the new key. We would need to update the Therium Spaces as well, but our members have to do that. Now, since we have 70 members in total currently.. It isn't very practical to force them to update their therium spaces every time we kick someone out. So I thought up two solutions, but there are big flaws in these: Solution one is to have two seperate keys, one for the Therium Spaces and one for the official Therium Levels. the Therium Spaces key would NEVER be refreshed, which means members won't ever be forced to update their spaces. But the official therium level key would be updated each time a member gets kicked out. This, however, requires us to hand out the new key to every member each time we kick someone out. It is already better than what we have now, but it still requires a truckload of work each time we kick someone. The second solution is almost the same as the first, except that the official therium levels would not be protected by a Sticker, but by a code. The code would be announced on our forum every time we update it, and would only be accesible for members. But, a huge problem with this, is that a member could just tell the code to someone else, which would make him partly a member (not completely, because that person wouldn't be listed in our member list). And the person who told the code could just keep supplying his friends (who haven't been approved), with the code every time it is updated. So now my question to you guys is, what is a good solution that wouldn't require a large sticker refresh or a forced update on all our members, but is very secure? TL;DR: My clan has no good system for kicking people out, and i'm looking for a solution.

2010-04-16 20:55:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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Maybe a combination of both? Like a sticker switch and a four-digit code?

2010-04-17 06:09:00 Author: srgt_poptart Posts: 425

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I agree with Srgt_poptart, a combination of the two would "solve" your issue. Creating a sticker based combination lock would solve the issue, as only people with stickers can open the lock, and of the people with stickers, only members would know the code. However, these ex members will still be able to access the profile levels, and any keys that they have collected will still be valid. Additionally, people within the clan can still send the codes to ex members. I have to ask though, why are these levels being locked up in the first place? Adding complicated locks may keep people out, but they also take up a good portion of the thermometer. It just seems a bit odd to me for this level of security on levels

2010-04-17 06:42:00 Author: Burnvictim42 Posts: 3322

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Hmm.. A combination of sticker and code eh? That sounds just about right! . Thanks! They might send the code to ex members, but we would change the code every time a few persons had been kicked, so the code would eventually be invalid for ex-members. And if someone's sharing the code, we just need to catch them in action. The Therium Spaces are locked because they are "premium content" for our members. It's just a little extra for all our members . They are only accesible to members who are in therium/have once been in Therium.The nice thing about Therium Spaces, is that the more members we have, the more published therium spaces there are.. generating publicity for Therium (since every Therium Lock has a key to the clan info level in it.. although most of them broke, sadly.). And it's just fun for members to make, it's their initial creating experience in therium . Their own personal spot to show to other members. And the official Therium levels are locked because they contain information that is only for our members. Although I agree some of our levels shouldn't have a lock. The lock mechanism uses up very, very little thermometer. It's just a box which Sackboy spawns in, with a black pane in the back with a sticker switch on it. Some of our members have constructed their own custom Locks though, which use up more thermometer. Okay, i've renewed the solution: The Therium Spaces will have the old lock mechanism. This means kicked members can access them, but that's not too big of a deal. The official Therium levels will be locked using a combination of the current Key sticker, and a new code lock mechanism. The Code will be announced on our website, only to members, and will be renewed whenever we have kicked a few members. Thanks a lot, guys! . This seems like a really good solution. We wouldn't need to refresh the sticker ever. Just the code.

2010-04-18 09:23:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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Using stickers is just asking for trouble. It's easy to nick stickers. I would recommend using only a password. In societies like the S∴M∴ the word for admittance is abrogated with each equinox, the new word choosen usually encompasses and represents the current of that temple or lodge for the next 6 months. You could do something like that.

2010-04-19 16:31:00 Author: Ayneh Posts: 2454

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@Burnvictim42: I made a combination lock that requires you to sticker the Therium Key sticker first, and then input the code. It works fine. Thanks a lot, it's a great solution @Ayneh: If you are talking about the bug in the game that allows people to put stickers on their sackboys and use it to open/activate various sticker switches - it's been fixed by MM. And the Therium Sticker is not sharable by anyone but me, so we're pretty safe

2010-04-23 05:58:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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can i join? my levels suck, besides my cave & forest level witch is VERY short. BUT im determind to get better, and i dont have much dlc or time to make levels cause of school

2010-04-23 08:07:00 Author: YEAH_NAH Posts: 775

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Is it worth mentioning that there's no security in a clan? Someone can use their access card to let friends into a level. If there's a player counter, the friends can just turn their controllers off. A person can even record video of the base, alone.

2010-04-26 01:04:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Is it worth mentioning that there's no security in a clan? Someone can use their access card to let friends into a level. If there's a player counter, the friends can just turn their controllers off. A person can even record video of the base, alone. Well... the whole notion of an LBP clan is quite silly if you ask me... but whatever makes people happy. I guess you could call LBPC a clan, eh? But what'd be the point? /2 cents

2010-04-26 14:16:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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Fully agree with comph, Random quote from random (clan) person: If you make one clan member angry, you get a whole spammage of 1 stars, spam pictures and flamemails at your adress.So Id avoid clans at all costs.

2010-04-26 16:30:00 Author: Luos_83 Posts: 2136

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@comphermc: (Sorry for the long wall of text) I made Therium because I was searching for creators to create online with before, but had trouble finding anyone. I looked at the cool pages a few weeks after the Online Create feature came out, and was disappointed that there wasn't any levels made with a huge group of people, that exceeded any community levels before it. I decided to start a group of creators, which at that time was about 10 people. I foolishly called it "clan" at some point, but i shouldn't have done that, for it isn't really a clan. It's more of a group of creators, organised into sub-teams, but free to create with whomever they want. I kept it private and inaccesible to non-members, so that it wouldn't grow out into a huge community, but stayed a close-knit group, while constantly growing in size. We don't have any enemies, and I don't want to make any enemies, as my opinion is that clan wars are pointless - and if we don't wage any wars with other clans, there's a high chance other clan leaders will let their members join Therium as a side-group. We try to keep internet trolls and general a-holes out of Therium, although some have managed to get in - but we just kick them out. A requirement for joining Therium is being friendly. @Incinerator22: You have a point. However it isn't so bad if members let non-members into the levels. They're still not on the member list, so they aren't members. And recording a video of the levels.. It consists of about 70 levels (and constantly growing)) + 7 official levels. So it would take a long time to record.. @Luos_Desruc: That might be the case for some clans, but we do our best to keep out the internet trolls. Once again, the word "clan" sounds elitist in my opinion. Therium is more of a "group of creators". @YEAH_NAH: Sure. Even if your levels aren't that good, if you are friendly and willing to learn, we will let you in. I'm hard to reach on PSN though, if you're having trouble reaching me, message one of the Admins or Leaders (the list of admins and leaders + the members can be found on http://www.therium.us.tt/forum/showthread.php?tid=21) Aside from all of this, thanks for helping me with a good solution to our security problem .

2010-04-26 20:39:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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I made Therium because I was searching for creators to create online with before, but had trouble finding anyone. I looked at the cool pages a few weeks after the Online Create feature came out, and was disappointed that there wasn't any levels made with a huge group of people, that exceeded any community levels before it. First of all, the cool pages do not reflect the best levels out there, rather the mediocre crap we all have seen 100's of times. second of all, there have been many many levels that exceeded all community levels before that, but they would never appear on the cool pages because the average person cannot comprehend its shear awesomeness.

2010-04-26 22:08:00 Author: Luos_83 Posts: 2136

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I made Therium because I was searching for creators to create online with before, but had trouble finding anyone. I looked at the cool pages a few weeks after the Online Create feature came out, and was disappointed that there wasn't any levels made with a huge group of people, that exceeded any community levels before it. I decided to start a group of creators, which at that time was about 10 people. I foolishly called it "clan" at some point, but i shouldn't have done that, for it isn't really a clan. It's more of a group of creators, organised into sub-teams, but free to create with whomever they want. I kept it private and inaccesible to non-members, so that it wouldn't grow out into a huge community, but stayed a close-knit group, while constantly growing in size. We don't have any enemies, and I don't want to make any enemies, as my opinion is that clan wars are pointless - and if we don't wage any wars with other clans, there's a high chance other clan leaders will let their members join Therium as a side-group. We try to keep internet trolls and general a-holes out of Therium, although some have managed to get in - but we just kick them out. A requirement for joining Therium is being friendly. You have access cards, levels made only for the members of your clan, rules and other social requirements, and even a heart requirement...? To me, that's a clan. What is the point? That's a big question, but the more I learn about your Therium, the more you contradict yourself. You want to help abolish the cool levels' problems and make the community a better place, right? Then why aren't you publishing your levels for the community, instead of your clan? The way I see it, all the benefits of a clan are given, and more, from a good fansite like LBPC. I want to be with people who have the same interests as me. LBPC is generally a forum for the best and most devoted fans of LBP. There's the freedom for privacy within groups. Even if some of your friends don't have LBPC, you can ask them to join. Also, we don't have unnecessary rules, and we don't deprive people of this site because of occasional rudeness or being a bad creator. I like the idea of bases, lounges, clan campaigns, and access cards. These are sometimes the levels and features that people want to play, but why would you ever want them to have to be for clan members only? Furthermore, you're wasting your time on making all these levels and clan objects. I want an organised way to have good creators come together to make levels in online create. I think this is your main reason for your clan, but you don't need a clan to do it. There are plenty of online create levels out there that were made without a clan. If you want examples, look toward "Cap'n Sackbeard's Booty", all the levels for the "LBPC Online Create Contest" that were all made without the involvement of clans, or even the "LBPC Logic Pack". Even casual levels often have people help each other. "Dragons of Myth: Teohtuican" is another example. The reason these people help each other is because of friendship, not the fact that they both share the membership of a clan. In my opinion, I think a clan is just a waste of time.

2010-04-26 22:55:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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cool thnx it might be hard to play though 'cause of time zones ill be on in 1-2 days (school & home work )

2010-04-27 07:07:00 Author: YEAH_NAH Posts: 775

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May I join? I work on long-term projects in LBP and I'm willing to listen and collaborate with people I barely know ^_^ Not an amazingly skilled creator, but I'm easy to hang out with and willing to learn from your community I think I'd make a good member Also, Incinerator22, I think (THINK) the reason clans are so bloody popular is that the general online community in LBP are teenagers. Teenagers who like to be in groups and "belong". Eh?

2010-04-28 06:45:00 Author: KablooieKablam Posts: 364

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You have access cards, levels made only for the members of your clan, rules and other social requirements, and even a heart requirement...? To me, that's a clan. What is the point? That's a big question, but the more I learn about your Therium, the more you contradict yourself. You want to help abolish the cool levels' problems and make the community a better place, right? Then why aren't you publishing your levels for the community, instead of your clan? We have access cards, levels made only for the members, rules and other social requirements, but no heart requirement. We judge people based on their skill in create mode and their friendliness towards us and our members. If someone acts friendly to get in but starts to behave very rude if we don't look, we warn/kick/ban that person depending on how bad it is. While it would be nice if the cool levels got fixed, my concern is not fixing the problems in the cool levels system or the community. I want to bring lots of creators together so that they can co-operate in big teams with eachother. As for why I am not publishing levels for the community... Therium Spaces are premium content for our members, and most members have a great time making them. But you have a point, we should lock down a little less, and publish stuff for the community. The announcement board doesn't really need to be locked down, although the storage area does. Aside from the official levels, though, there are some levels in the works by our members, playable for the entire community . Right now, there's only one: The Wild Wild West by n4spm The way I see it, all the benefits of a clan are given, and more, from a good fansite like LBPC. You're right, and I think LBPC is a great site. And we do not want to replace LBPC, nor be an enemy of LBPC. But it is hard (or it has been, for me) for creators to get in touch with expert creators and start to create with them. Most of them are already taken. My idea behind Therium is a large community, but not open for joining without validation, where everyone is in tight contact with eachother. Where, if you wanted to create with someone, there would, most of the time, be someone to create with. You could call my idea behind Therium a closed version of LBPC, although not nearly as big, and LBPC has way better management. This is the first clan I have ever started, so i'm still learning how to lead a group. I want to be with people who have the same interests as me. LBPC is generally a forum for the best and most devoted fans of LBP. There's the freedom for privacy within groups. Even if some of your friends don't have LBPC, you can ask them to join. Also, we don't have unnecessary rules, and we don't deprive people of this site because of occasional rudeness or being a bad creator. But our goals are different. LBPC, as you have described it, is a site for all devoted fans of LBP to come together and chat and create. But Therium, is a closed (but supposed to be easy-to-join), group where creators can find the partners they need quickly. (although that is not always the case) I like the idea of bases, lounges, clan campaigns, and access cards. These are sometimes the levels and features that people want to play, but why would you ever want them to have to be for clan members only? Furthermore, you're wasting your time on making all these levels and clan objects. Hmm.. you're right about that. Okay, you have convinced me, I will open up Therium Spaces for everyone to play. But I need something to show it is by Therium members, otherwise people will make levels like the therium spaces and publish it under "[Therium] <name>'s Space". And nobody will be able to tell the difference between member and non-member Spaces anymore. But I agree, we should probably open up Therium spaces for the public. I want an organised way to have good creators come together to make levels in online create. I think this is your main reason for your clan, but you don't need a clan to do it. There are plenty of online create levels out there that were made without a clan. If you want examples, look toward "Cap'n Sackbeard's Booty", all the levels for the "LBPC Online Create Contest" that were all made without the involvement of clans, or even the "LBPC Logic Pack". Even casual levels often have people help each other. "Dragons of Myth: Teohtuican" is another example. That's the main reason, yes. Those are great ways to bring creators together, but the LBPC OC contest was temporary, and most of the levels you've mentioned were made by close friends. Great levels though (I have played many LBPC OC Contest entries, and the LBPC Logic Pack - there's some great stuff in there ). The reason these people help each other is because of friendship, not the fact that they both share the membership of a clan. But members of the clan can create with anyone they want, even if those people are not members of the clan (such as their friends). Therium is just a means to bring many creators together, and keep them in close contact. And these creators can, in turn, help non-members. In my opinion, I think a clan is just a waste of time. I don't think so. Members have already made some great stuff, and everyone is friendly to eachother. They're creating with eachother, and having fun. And a nice extra is, i'm learning how to lead a group. Thanks for all the advice. -------------- @YEAH_NAH, Kablooie_Kablam: I'm going to add you guys now, and evaluate you (based on friendliness and skills in create mode).

2010-04-28 12:51:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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Im sorry im a Admin of Therium and may i remind you that this is a thread asking for help on our key problem, not a thead quoting why clans may be a waste of time

2010-04-28 17:59:00 Author: tombraiders Posts: 6

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Im sorry im a Admin of Therium and may i remind you that this is a thread asking for help on our key problem, not a thead quoting why clans may be a waste of time Aw, please don't interrupt this conversation. I want to continue this discussion because it's a good discussion, and it's giving me tons of idea's. @YEAH_NAH, @Kablooie_Kablam: You weren't online. Please accept my friend request on robinlint if you want to be evaluated. (Or ask one of the other admins or Leaders - go to http://www.therium.us.tt/memberlist for our list of Admins, Leaders, and members.)

2010-04-28 18:29:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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@Kablooie_Kablam: You weren't online. Please accept my friend request on robinlint if you want to be evaluated. (Or ask one of the other admins or Leaders - go to http://www.therium.us.tt/memberlist for our list of Admins, Leaders, and members.) I accepted it ^^ Hope to see you online soon!

2010-04-29 09:35:00 Author: KablooieKablam Posts: 364

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I accepted it ^^ Hope to see you online soon! You were never online when I was. Perhaps you should ask another Admin or Leader for your evaluation, if we're in different timezones. Also, I made a new account on PSN, robbit10. If you still want me to evaluate you, please add me.

2010-05-08 17:25:00 Author: robbit10 Posts: 450

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