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#1

Industrial Assistance 2

Archive: 79 posts

So, I've been wanting to make a two player level again for a while. After messing with locations and themes for the next level in my series I just couldn't find something that I was happy with so thought this would be the perfect opportunity to make an Industrial Assistance 2.

I've had a few ideas for 2 player sections that I've wanted to create for ages so I'm pretty enthusiastic about it at the minute. I've managed to get the first 4-5 sections complete and now I've got the simpler stuff out of the way I can move onto the ideas and contraptions that made me want to make this in the first place!

With being enthusiastic at the minute I'm powering through it. If i carry on like this I should have it out before the end of the month quite comfortably!		2010-02-09 00:50:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

If i carry on like this I should have it out before the end of the month quite comfortably!

I hate you so much. I really do.		2010-02-09 02:12:00

Author:
rtm223
Posts: 6497

lol rtm. Love is very subjective. And I love jack's levels

Especially two-player levels, I've always been a big fan of them.		2010-02-09 02:14:00

Author:
Incinerator22
Posts: 3251

I hate you so much. I really do.

It's your own fault!

Rtm's LBP schedule.........................VS............... ........Everyone else's schedule

Makes an obstacle.......................................... ...........................Makes an obstacle

Wires up the logic............................................. ........................Wires up the logic

Looks at it and thinks he can make it in less parts................................Moves onto the next scene.

Makes logic again using only 1 piece of DM
which contains 2 corners and half a mag key.......................................Makes a new section

Makes a blog on it................................................ ....................Adds finishes touches

Finds out Comphermc has made it using only
a third of a mag key and cries like a girll..........................................Pub lishes the level.


Rtm: The only person who takes the base off the scoreboard to save thermo 		2010-02-09 02:58:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Rtm: The only person who takes the base off the scoreboard to save thermo

Oh My God! Possibly the funniest thing I've ever read!! Holy crap. Haha.

Um... yeah, so can't wait for the level to drop... 		2010-02-09 03:04:00

Author:
comphermc
Posts: 5338

I hate you so much. I really do.

I really don't know why you do it to yourself... just limit yourself to a week or two like the rest of us!

@Jackofcourse: That was really funny.		2010-02-09 08:29:00

Author:
ladylyn1
Posts: 836

Haha, nice one, Jack.

Funny, I always wanted you to make a sequel to IA, but now it's just bad news. The rest of us might as well give up on that LBW competition. 		2010-02-09 10:22:00

Author:
Rogar
Posts: 2284

... and cries with a girl

Cries with a girl? That's.... baffling...

Haha, my workflow is very much different to that, but the end result is the same: Hissyfits at not being 100% happy with the project so I drop it and move onto something else

@lyn: I'm not one for sticking to my comfort zone and IMO, that's the only way to produce a level in a week or two. Hell, you need at least two weeks to tune up all the tiny, subtle details that no-one but yourself will ever notice 		2010-02-09 11:15:00

Author:
rtm223
Posts: 6497

haha yes, cries with a girl. (I'm standing by my typo.)

@Rogar. I'm judging that contest, so I can safely say I won't be entering it 		2010-02-09 15:44:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

this is too funny!
...and Comphermc, u shouldn't be laughting! u probably have the weirdest OCD methods out of all of us!		2010-02-09 16:09:00

Author:
javi haguse
Posts: 744

Cries with a girl? That's.... baffling...

thats it... try to get some dignity back

as for the thread Yay! i really enjoyed the first one, i hope its as good		2010-02-09 16:42:00

Author:
Kern
Posts: 5078

@Rogar. I'm judging that contest, so I can safely say I won't be entering it

"And the winner is.... ME!!! Mwahahahaha!"


I don't see any problem with that But yes, apparently somewhere in all this, someone mentioned making a level that is likely to see the light of day sometime soon. What are you thinking jack, similar concepts to the original, or is the plan to outdo yourself?		2010-02-09 16:48:00

Author:
rtm223
Posts: 6497

I really don't know why you do it to yourself... just limit yourself to a week or two like the rest of us!

A week or two? Are you serious? Even when I have my levels fully planned, I usually looking at a very intense 4 week schedule. It takes me a week just to figure out what I want to do in the level :


@Jackofcourse: That was really funny.
Really really funny.		2010-02-09 17:03:00

Author:
Thegide
Posts: 1465

@Rtm: Somewhere in between I think. From the two player levels I've played I've noticed a lot of them are based around the same concept:

'Player 1 activates a switch, that allows Player 2 to get somewhere. Player 2 then activates another switch which allows Player 1 to join them.'

Now when you consider it, 2 player levels pretty much have to abide by this rule in a lot of cases. I'm just concentrating on making it so it doesn't feel so regimented and repetitive. Wanting all the puzzles and section to feel different and innovative.		2010-02-09 17:07:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

You could play some of Mnniska's levels for inspiration. I believe he has a two player level as well.2010-02-09 17:22:00

Author:
Syroc
Posts: 3193

Now when you consider it, 2 player levels pretty much have to abide by this rule in a lot of cases. I'm just concentrating on making it so it doesn't feel so regimented and repetitive. Wanting all the puzzles and section to feel different and innovative.

Heh, my thoughts exactly. I hope we don't end up building the same thing... not very likely though, as mine's going to have a story! 		2010-02-09 19:17:00

Author:
Rogar
Posts: 2284

A week or two? Are you serious? Even when I have my levels fully planned, I usually looking at a very intense 4 week schedule. It takes me a week just to figure out what I want to do in the level :


Oh yeah the planning stage takes about a month- but in that i only draw the level... im at university without a ps3 so thats the best i can do. When i get back I make the level in about 5-6 days. Check out 'Planet X' or any of the 'Whichever Way the Wind Blows' they were all made in 5 days.

Of course i work constantly (about 12 hours per day) in that short time


@rtm: I don't really think i was in my comfort zone when i made Planet X and that still took me less than a week to make- almost all thermos maxed in it too.		2010-02-09 19:33:00

Author:
ladylyn1
Posts: 836

This is coming along nicely! Probably about 40% done now. Time to start ramping up the complexity a bit and try out some more complicated sections! 2010-02-11 15:43:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Nice! I've been waiting for you to make a sequel. Though as you said, dont make it too repetetive.

And by the way post some pics! start building the hype!		2010-02-11 16:11:00

Author:
Tamland
Posts: 106

I really want to make this quite tricky and not really for the casual gamer. Some of the ideas I've put into it would lead to some truly awesome gameplay if you cranked it all up a notch. It could make some really addictive stuff

However, seeing as it's a sequel, it feels that I should make it of a similar difficulty to the first and continue in the same way.

Maybe I'll just make an extreme version as well 		2010-02-11 21:51:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Very funny...
I hope you outdo yourself, I need a another new Jack level to play. I would love to see part of it if you were willing to let me see...		2010-02-11 21:58:00

Author:
tanrockstan34
Posts: 1076

I'm really happy with it so far. I honestly think it is better than the first quite comfortably!

I just said to Killzone, I'm keeping it quite close to me testing wise at the minute. Only Compher has seen it really and that's because I was picking his logic brains. With it being a sequel I'm quite excited about seeing what people think so want it to be a total surprise. There's also the two player competition going on at the minute so I don't want to be giving my ideas away

The only time I have someone test it really is if I have something new and I'm not sure about it, then I'll just grab whoever is online at that time, so if you're online when I need someone then you have a good chance!

Thanks for the offer though, it is very much appreciated!		2010-02-11 22:07:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

I have some pretty great ideas for 2 player gameplay, which where impossible to set up in 'Howdy Partner' because of theme restrictions. Some of 'em were pretty darn psychedelic. I pretty much guess anything works in your levels, because the theme is yours, no "I cannot have a minecart here becasue we are in the clouds" sort of thing.

I will remake Teamwo2k! The Second to fit how I've improved because it's actually quite terrible in my eyes. New theme to inspire me, plus I just wanna be known as "That two player guy" =P		2010-02-11 22:07:00

Author:
KQuinn94Z
Posts: 1758

Nice to know!

I've had a X2 Puzzle in the Back of my Head for awhile This just reminded me!		2010-02-11 22:34:00

Author:
Nurolight
Posts: 918

Wow, by reading through this thread its made me quite excited about seeing this level published.
The enthusiasm you have is great lol

I really want to make this quite tricky and not really for the casual gamer. Some of the ideas I've put into it would lead to some truly awesome gameplay if you cranked it all up a notch. It could make some really addictive stuff
"not really for the casual gamer" ooo im interested even more now, i like a challenge and it sounds like your making it a fun challenging level, il be sure to drag one of my friends to my pod to play this! Keep up the hard work! 		2010-02-11 23:27:00

Author:
Fenderjt
Posts: 1969

Thanks I've decided that I am going to keep it tame so that pretty much everyone can complete it. But with a few of the ideas in the level there's definitely scope to crank the difficulty right up and have some real challenging stuff in there. Like I said, I might make a extreme version or something 2010-02-11 23:33:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

An extreme version might be fun as I tend to like hard levels just as much as easily completable ones.2010-02-11 23:54:00

Author:
tanrockstan34
Posts: 1076

Cool, I loved the first one, I need to see it.

You show me yours and I'll show you mine 		2010-02-12 00:14:00

Author:
GruntosUK
Posts: 1754

I look forward to the finished level . You could probably push the difficulty more than you'd normally do, two players are far more likely to work out the tricker stuff between them than just a solo player.2010-02-12 00:51:00

Author:
julesyjules
Posts: 1156

I look forward to the finished level . You could probably push the difficulty more than you'd normally do, two players are far more likely to work out the tricker stuff between them than just a solo player.

Yeah I definitely agree with that I've just finished the idea that made me want to make the level in the first place and I'm really happy with it. I do wish I could do a bit more with it, but I think the level of difficulty that it is at at the minute is probably about right. I think I will have another section with the same concept later on. I'll be able to change it up enough so it shouldn't feel repetitive and it will also give the players a chance to swap roles and each do the different thing! 		2010-02-12 01:18:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Very cool! I can't wait to see it finished!2010-02-12 02:13:00

Author:
piggabling
Posts: 2979

Things have slowed down a little! Need some new ideas! But I'm still more than half way through it I would say. 4 or 5 more sections and I'm all done! 2010-02-15 01:56:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

I've got ideas.... but you gotta show me first.... 2010-02-15 15:11:00

Author:
KQuinn94Z
Posts: 1758

what about a thing where you have to keep paintballing a switch which then drops a barrier and opens another so they can paintball another switch?2010-02-15 16:26:00

Author:
Kern
Posts: 5078

I'm working on a different concept with someone in that the two players remain split up for a large point of the level, perhaps in neighbouring corridors, and actions in one corridor affect the other. Instead of the repetitive separation and joining up of the two players they remain separated. Obviously the checkpoint issue will be problematic but the point at which the paths separate will simply have to be after the checkpoint. It's a different way of making a 2-player level and isn't practical for a whole level as popping can make it unfinishable. But it's a concept you may want to try out.2010-02-15 16:29:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

I know you've seen it in the other 2 player thread as well, we're discussing how to make the checkpoints work therre if you wan't to check it out 2010-02-15 17:18:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

I'm working on a different concept with someone in that the two players remain split up for a large point of the level, perhaps in neighbouring corridors, and actions in one corridor affect the other. Instead of the repetitive separation and joining up of the two players they remain separated. Obviously the checkpoint issue will be problematic but the point at which the paths separate will simply have to be after the checkpoint. It's a different way of making a 2-player level and isn't practical for a whole level as popping can make it unfinishable. But it's a concept you may want to try out.

Yeah I will come and have a look

Splitting up for parts of the level is something that I did quite a bit in the first level, and something I think I've probably done even more in this level. Personally, I'd never consider doing it for the whole level because of the checkpoint problem. It either means you would have to have the level very easy so the chances of them dying and having to start again are very slim, or run the risk of the level becoming frustrating seeing as they would probably have to keep doing the same parts over and over again.

There's a level by Heckboy88 where the the players are split for a very long time at the start, and that does get frustrating if you keep dying.

You could possibly track the player on each side and if one of them dies, have it so a switch recognises that and moves the checkpoint to which side they need to come out on. Although I'm really not the person to ask about stuff like that, far too advanced! And I would hazard a guess that there would be lots of limitations of it too.		2010-02-15 17:22:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Lol this is confusing discussing this across two threads

Comph's respawn idea sounds cool, though - I sort of churned out ideas in my other post and I don't think I explained it well. The net result would be, though, that at all times the checkpoint at the start would be active. In one corridor would be a respawn pad, the other a checkpoint. The respawn pad activates the checkpoint for a limited time, allowing one player to respawn, then reverts back to the starting checkpoint. Thus if the player pops they go back to the start as punishment 		2010-02-15 17:38:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

haha it is getting a bit confusing!

I will keep an eye on the other thread seeing as that's where it started! That does sound like it could work quite well though if done right! Will be interested to see this.		2010-02-15 17:40:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Wheres this thread?

my idea would be an Inverted Sensor switch on each corridor connected to a checkpoint		2010-02-15 17:41:00

Author:
Kern
Posts: 5078

https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=22630-2-players-level

Yup that's the general idea. Although a bit more complicated! 		2010-02-15 17:42:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

The Inverted Sensor Idea might work but it wouldn't be failure-proof. If one player pops the inverted sensor would not trigger the right checkpoint until after the player dies, therefore possibly causing them to spawn out the wrong checkpoint the moment before the active one changes. I haven't tried this idea out yet, and the swnsors wouldhave to be huge to cover the entire level, and painstakingly adjusted for the right areas. But it's an idea, and possibly one that could turn out to be simpler than the respawn pad idea2010-02-15 17:50:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

@Rtm: Somewhere in between I think. From the two player levels I've played I've noticed a lot of them are based around the same concept:

'Player 1 activates a switch, that allows Player 2 to get somewhere. Player 2 then activates another switch which allows Player 1 to join them.'

Now when you consider it, 2 player levels pretty much have to abide by this rule in a lot of cases. I'm just concentrating on making it so it doesn't feel so regimented and repetitive. Wanting all the puzzles and section to feel different and innovative.

This is so true - I was playing a bunch of Two Player levels last night and IA stood out amongst them because the majority of the time it wasn't just this ^^

So yeah, I loved the first one and I hope this is twice as good 		2010-02-15 17:52:00

Author:
Coxy224
Posts: 2645

I'm not sure if I'm going mad or this actually happened but I'm sure the thermo has dropped!

Probably 4-5 sections ago the thermo was on 30%, now I can't honestly say I've looked at it properly since then but I've noticed it at at least 40-45% since then. I went in today and it's back to around 30%! Any reason why there would be a sudden drop in thermo?

The thermo is looking ridiculously good to be honest. I think it is probably in a publishable state now and wouldn't be considered too short. To say it's only on 30% is quite crazy!		2010-02-16 16:51:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

You don't tend to use a lot of materials in your levels, which really helps to save on thermo. Maybe you used material changer to get rid of one or two materials and didn't check the thermo at the time?2010-02-16 17:24:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

Nah I haven't added any different materials since the very start so it won't be that. Materials don't effect it that much anyway unless you go mad with them.

Not sure what it could be. It could just be my eyes! 		2010-02-16 17:29:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Just add a ton of new sections Looking forward to it2010-02-16 18:05:00

Author:
Unknown User

=P Too-Fast Fail!
http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/ad217/Tommy012345/Test1.gif

Basically, One is required to grab his team mates feet, to be able to Just make the leap over!		2010-02-16 21:11:00

Author:
Nurolight
Posts: 918

That is so cool, what a good idea. No-one would ever guess it though. But that is ingenious.2010-02-16 21:58:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

Yeah that is a great idea! I suppose you could make a little poster-sticker that shows what you have to do, but some people just can't read pictures so yeah.... I don't know how well that would fly. Lol 2010-02-16 23:23:00

Author:
piggabling
Posts: 2979

It is a cool idea Have you tried to create it?2010-02-17 17:16:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

New x2 level by jack, yyyaaaaaaay!
I'm really looking forward to this 		2010-02-17 17:42:00

Author:
Alec
Posts: 3871

I had a go with that grab the other players feet before and it works quite well! Very good idea there!

I'm making a 2 player race at the minute, both split off and have to get through the same obstacle course but you each have your own path so you don't get in each others way. It's the only part in it that's not co-op related, but I thought it'd be a nice change of pace going from helping each other out all the way through to a quick competitive race! 		2010-02-18 02:06:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Wow, great idea with that "grabbing the other player's feet" idea. I'm wondering if you can make a x4 area using this concept... :o2010-02-18 03:40:00

Author:
comphermc
Posts: 5338

haha a 4 player Sackboy swing would be awesome. Well I've done the race platforming section. I had it so it was pretty difficult but have tamed enough now hopefully. I reckon my next project will be a challenging no nonsense platforming level though. Got quite a few ideas from this that I wanted to put it but they just wouldn't have matched up to difficulty level of the rest of it. I'm thinking 2/3 more sections and then all done! Hopefully by the end of the weekend.2010-02-18 04:36:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Why can't you put a checkpoint in a "gap" area between the sections at strategic points, then the players can put themselves in their corridors automatically?2010-02-18 07:58:00

Author:
RCIX
Posts: 250

That's pretty much my only other option that I could easily implement. If I can help it I would prefer to keep it all in one section. With it being a race I'd rather not have to split it up and ruin the flow.

Will do some testing and see how easy/hard it plays and see from there! 		2010-02-18 08:10:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Here's an idea, Above the platform is a hamster wheel of sorts, and below the platform is pitch black water that's almost impossible to see, it requires on person to run on the hamster wheel to activate the lights, so a swimming sack can navigate the obstacles..,2010-02-18 22:41:00

Author:
Kern
Posts: 5078

That's a pretty cool idea. Although I'm not using water so it would be quite tricky! haha

Had a few people test the race section and they managed it pretty comfortably (some of them ) so I'm quite happy with that!

A few more sections and it all should be sorted 		2010-02-18 22:52:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Well maybe for Industrial Assistance 3 eh?

Why not make a "Perfect Sync" room? Where it requires a grab or a shot of paint at almost exactly the same time,		2010-02-18 23:08:00

Author:
Kern
Posts: 5078

When I read this I gasped and said "can it really be?" Well it is and its going to be amazing so yea.2010-02-18 23:13:00

Author:
austimerr
Posts: 385

That's a pretty cool idea. Although I'm not using water so it would be quite tricky! haha

Had a few people test the race section and they managed it pretty comfortably (some of them ) so I'm quite happy with that!

A few more sections and it all should be sorted

That wasn't because it was difficult. It was because I suck. And so does your broadband... 		2010-02-18 23:14:00

Author:
KQuinn94Z
Posts: 1758

haha it wasn't you I was talking about...it was more Rtm Although he was trying to do it speedy in his defence 2010-02-18 23:22:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

But I died too. I was funny when you disconnected (Yes I'm blaming you), I made an attempt to break off backwars and see the rest of the level... But I died...again...2010-02-18 23:28:00

Author:
KQuinn94Z
Posts: 1758

haha you wouldn't have got very far anyway. Not only is there a door that only opens from the other side straight away...but you were attempting to do it on your own in a 2 player level

Well I've got 1 more section and then some kind of ending to do and then it's ready for publish

(The thermo is only on 50% too! )		2010-02-19 04:12:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

haha it wasn't you I was talking about...it was more Rtm Although he was trying to do it speedy in his defence

My excuse remains that I suck! I play, on average, 2-3 levels a week, if that. Plus I have absolutely no concept whatsoever of my own limitations so I just run headlong into whatever's there! The race is fine in terms of difficulty and if it's not required for both to get through, it shouldn't be tough at all. The only issue you may find is that people believe they both need to get through, so if one dies the other pops themselves, which would increase the difficulty greatly because of the perception of what is required is greater than what actually is.

But it's unlikely to be an issue.		2010-02-19 09:58:00

Author:
rtm223
Posts: 6497

My excuse remains that I suck! I play, on average, 2-3 levels a week, if that. Plus I have absolutely no concept whatsoever of my own limitations so I just run headlong into whatever's there! The race is fine in terms of difficulty and if it's not required for both to get through, it shouldn't be tough at all. The only issue you may find is that people believe they both need to get through, so if one dies the other pops themselves, which would increase the difficulty greatly because of the perception of what is required is greater than what actually is.

But it's unlikely to be an issue.

Yeah that's the main thing that was worrying me about it. I've made a little sign at the gate saying that it's a race though. So that should help clear up any confusion about it 		2010-02-19 16:32:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

(The thermo is only on 50% too! )

Wow!

As for an Ending, Maybe some sort of Inter-Weaving Industrial Kart-Type Ride (Like the Race with Ze Dude, But no-one Crashes )		2010-02-19 18:03:00

Author:
Nurolight
Posts: 918

I'm literally just making the ending now. The kart race actually sounds pretty cool, but remembering how much effort it took to make the ending of the last one...I'm going to stick to my little puzzler ending for this one haha 2010-02-19 18:06:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

wow this sounds great jack looking forward to it XD2010-02-19 18:52:00

Author:
Unknown_creator
Posts: 119

I remember somewhere you said it took you 3 months to making Timberland 1, and how fast you are building this now.2010-02-19 22:12:00

Author:
KQuinn94Z
Posts: 1758

Well I'm hoping to have this done by tomorrow, maybe the day after depending on how it goes. I just need to add a small section inside my final section, link up bubbles for the secret areas, add music, and do a bit of polishing!

Hammering through it like I have was really good fun at the start, but it's got to the stage where it's annoying me now. I need to have a break or just get it finished. I probably should have a break from it but it would just frustrate me knowing that it is so close to finished and just sat there waiting!		2010-02-21 02:33:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Well I'm hoping to have this done by tomorrow, maybe the day after depending on how it goes. I just need to add a small section inside my final section, link up bubbles for the secret areas, add music, and do a bit of polishing!

& I'll just have to find someone to Play it with!		2010-02-21 11:49:00

Author:
Nurolight
Posts: 918

All sections complete! Bubbles and polishing left to do so should be published sometime tomorrow 2010-02-22 00:55:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Well this level is done fully done! I've created a thread over in the showcase area. It isn't yet published, but will be ASAP (probably tomorrow morning). Thank you for all your help and interest! 2010-02-22 23:57:00

Author:
jackofcourse
Posts: 1494

Played it today man, what a level! I don't reckon the kiddies will like it but the puzzles are so clever and unique - usually 2 player levels turn out to be: player one does something to let player two progress, player two does something to let player one join them - but I noticed the players stayed separated for longer periods, which changed the flow nicely. Excellent stuff.

EDIT: Oops, I'm now gonna go check the level showcase thread to give feedback in the right place 		2010-02-23 20:07:00

Author:
Holguin86
Posts: 875

i love your levels jack, Liked your Doctor Who level.. Can't wait for this! 2010-02-25 19:21:00

Author:
joshuaB37
Posts: 13

And you don't have to: it's out! 2010-02-26 09:44:00

Author:
Rogar
Posts: 2284

Yep. Check the Level Showcase.

Locked.

2010-02-26 11:20:00

Author:
comphermc
Posts: 5338


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