Archive: 57 posts

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So, as a distraction from my current primary creation (which is in turn a distraction from what is supposed to be my primary project), I'm doing an overhaul of subterranean setbacks. Why, I imagine you ask.... Well, there are large chunks of it that I'm not keen on and generally unhappy with, visually and in terms of the technology. Alongside this I'm going to publish an "easy mode". In italics as I doubt It'll be toned down to the kiddiwinks standard of LBP easy levels. This will be my gift to those people who left such commecnts as "amazing, but I hate you", "5 stars, but I am NEVER playing this again", etc. This will generally revolve around fine tuning the jumps to give wider margins of error. It may also involve tuning down the puzzles, adding hints here and there, plus save points, I haven't decided yet. I'd be interested to hear peoples thoughts on that one. TEH Aims of the Project So my aims for the redux are: Generally pretty up the place, epecially Lighting decoration Detail A couple of key ugly areas (entrance and boulder room) Attempt to make the sewer mutants not look **** Add a secrets counter / display at the end. Improve Multiplayer issues: I can now make a multiplayer sneak sensor (thank you sehven for poking me on that one) Plus there are a few bits of multiplayer tuning elsewhere that I never bothered to do. Obviously the key challenge is not making this stuff happen, it's finding the resources to spare. I have plenty of decorations thermo, but everything else I need is knackered, so welcome to the wall of resources, which I'll actually put on the next post.. No I won't, I'll put it here. Wait a mo.... TEH Wall of Resources So to achieve my aims, I need resources... largely collected objects and just objects / complex shapes. It's kinda difficult to quantify the complex shapes issues, but the other two I can. This is what is available in the current uploaded version: http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/rtm223/setbacks%20dev/APhoto_12-1.jpg That's 4 squares and 0 mag keys right there So, after around 45 minutes of tuning, I've condensed down the logic in the opening scene (up to the first grabby bit on the ceiling), and now I have: http://i600.photobucket.com/albums/tt82/rtm223/setbacks%20dev/APhoto_13-1.jpg So 26 squares, 11 mag keys, 11 mag switches, and 10 pistons. Woop woop!

2010-02-04 21:48:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Incredible is how a game that, basically, is always the same, can evolve in time. Yes, but in LittleBigPlanet everything is possible. Your project is ambitious, i remember that SS was pretty long, but beautiful. You can use new ways of using lights/details to improve the level, but you have to use the less thermometer possible, as always. That picture shows all the logic of the opening? Good job, i think that your prox logics will be like computers mini chips

2010-02-04 22:11:00 Author: Dante95 Posts: 504

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That picture shows all the logic of the opening? Good job, i think that your prox logics will be like computers mini chips It's what I've saved after stripping out all of the logic and doing a rebuild - the scene has exactly the same functionality, but the control system is so much more efficient. It was one of the earliest logic systems I made and evolved without any plan so naturally had no plan and was rather inefficent. Plus I've learned a lot since then Your project is ambitious, i remember that SS was pretty long, but beautiful. You can use new ways of using lights/details to improve the level, but you have to use the less thermometer possible, as always. It is ambitious, the level squeezes a lot out of the thermo, but there are quite a few places I can recover wasted thermo from. My first task is to do rebuilds in a few areas. Logic systems can be easily stripped down, the collapsing vent has a nasty mess of logic all around it and I may be brave enough to rebuild the generator. Once I have reduced down thermo useage as far as I can, I will take that wall of resource, add in the multiplayer systems then see what else I have for aesthetics.

2010-02-04 22:37:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Hmm how does that saying go... 'You can't polish a turd' That's the one! Not that that's relevant here or anything

2010-02-04 23:10:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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Please, I beg you, don't add a secrets counter It's not very original and not having things like that is one of the reasons I love this level. The theme stays phenomenally consistent throughout. Some pesky suggestions: -I know the boulder is a different color to be more obvious, but it seems too bright. And you already have a magic mouth pointed at it. -The rats are just really ugly. (I'm sorry lol) -A hint suggestion about the barrel: A lot of people don't know you can run on it. The first time I saw it I just kept jumping at it and jumping back like a grasshopper, and dieing a lot. I think there should be a hint (even in the hard version) triggered by ten or eleven deaths saying something like "this isn't working. maybe I can run on it to roll it?" -The global lighting darkness effect should set back to light faster, and be triggered by death and not respawning to eliminate multiplayer accidents. -I think you could get back some more thermo by removing the snakes used as vines and replacing them with tentacles -I think you could also remove some thermo by replacing the MGS spotlight in the elevator with a grab switch, also getting rid of multiplayer accidents. -Multiplayer accidents are coming up a lot here... I would absolutely love for this to be tweaked a little to make it multiplayer-friendly. I don't see what's that problematic besides two or three logic reorganizations and a few gas emmiters and moved checkpoints. I love playing this with friends. I think I have the high score for two and four players. Edit: Oh, good, that's one of your planned reformations

2010-02-04 23:17:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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@jack: I have a saying or two for you, but it's not suitable for a family forum. Please, I beg you, don't add a secrets counter It's not very original and not having things like that is one of the reasons I love this level. The theme stays phenomenally consistent throughout. Hmmmm, I dunno. A secrets counter is one of the things I was forced to cut, and I don't really know if originality was ever really one of the selling points of this level, certainly not for me - it's as cliched and derivative as they come! I really did want one TBH. I could always add a secret somewhere near the end that is in fact a secrets counter, would that do anything for ya? It has a certain dry humour that might fit with the theme. -I know the boulder is a different color to be more obvious, but it seems too bright. And you already have a magic mouth pointed at it. I did get complaints during playtesting that it just blended in, I could attempt some stickering to turn that basic metal into a different shade that might stand out, or do some lighting or something. -The rats are just really ugly. (I'm sorry lol) Rats are ugly though Which ones? The sleeping ones or the running ones? A hint suggestion about the barrel: A lot of people don't know you can run on it. The first time I saw it I just kept jumping at it and jumping back like a grasshopper, and dieing a lot. I think there should be a hint (even in the hard version) triggered by ten or eleven deaths saying something like "this isn't working. maybe I can run on it to roll it?" It'll be three deaths if anything. I'm kinda surprised it's hard to work out, if you run onto it it naturally starts moving. Or does jumping on it not do that? I could always give it a little nudge, using a winch to get it going just in case.... -The global lighting darkness effect should set back to light faster, and be triggered by death and not respawning to eliminate multiplayer accidents. Uh, I have plans for that, because I need to accomodate for the camera following the players all the way down. I'm thinking of having a thin layer of gas near the bottom of the screen that will drop if all players (or last player) is falling. Lighting will only be triggered in the case of all falling as well. -I think you could get back some more thermo by removing the snakes used as vines and replacing them with tentacles Sadly no, it'll save me some materials thermo probably, but seems to be identical on all the thermos that amtter too me. Plus it has suckers I think you could also remove some thermo by replacing the MGS spotlight in the elevator with a grab switch, also getting rid of multiplayer accidents. That might work, it's not something I'd actually thought of. The multiplayer is not an issue as I can just set it to require all if I do stick with the spotlight. Multiplayer accidents are coming up a lot here... I would absolutely love for this to be tweaked a little to make it multiplayer-friendly. I don't see what's that problematic besides two or three logic reorganizations and a few gas emmiters and moved checkpoints. I love playing this with friends. I think I have the high score for two and four players. The sneak sensor was the primary issue TBH, that was specifically a 1-player only device and just doesnt' make any sense in multiplayer without explicit explanation of the mechanics, which is not something I was willing to do. At the point I decided I was definitely keeping that, it became a 1-player level so I had little sympathy for those who can't read the signs Now that's less of an issue, I intend to block up all of the multiplayer holes. Technically the sneaking will only be 2-player safe, but should give enough of an illusion of multiplayer safety that it will work with 3/4. Ta for the feedbacks though, I'll be taking everything anyone says into account during this

2010-02-04 23:59:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Ta for the feedbacks though, I'll be taking everything anyone says into account during this Clearly you're not taking my feedback into account or you wouldn't bother carrying on!

2010-02-05 00:17:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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My suggestion is to make it harder! Seriously, I wonder if an easier version can ever be mainstream, or is is just too epic for the kiddies?

2010-02-05 00:29:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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I can't make it harder without a republishing, and you really don't want it put back into the state it used to be in before I toned it down for the world I don't think it'll be mainstream, or a level for the kiddies, even if for no other reason that the length is prohibitive for many of the players of this game. I do definitely get the impression that there are plenty of adults who appreciated it on a technical / objective level, but didn't actually find it in any way enjoyable.

2010-02-05 00:40:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I do definitely get the impression that there are plenty of adults who appreciated it on a technical / objective level, but didn't actually find it in any way enjoyable. Judging from a lot of the comments I have seen, I would definitely agree!

2010-02-05 00:44:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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I appreciated it on a jaw-droppingly fantastic orb of amazement level. And it totally flabbered my gast. lol.

2010-02-05 00:46:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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On the contrary, I found it quite enjoyable. Who are these people who can't appreciate a fantastic level when they see one? Also, you don't have many levels published if I'm correct, so maybe you could give away a key to an extreme version. I would totally try and conquer that.

2010-02-05 01:35:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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I'd be up for the extreme version too

2010-02-05 01:39:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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I do definitely get the impression that there are plenty of adults who appreciated it on a technical / objective level, but didn't actually find it in any way enjoyable.Yeah - that's me! I'd love a dumbed down version (erm... I mean an easier version). I thought it was fantastic but was unable to finish - despite several tries. I hasn't the skillz! So please, yes... add a v0rtex switch!

2010-02-05 02:59:00 Author: v0rtex Posts: 1878

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Ugh, an extreme version would be a nightmare.... tuning jumps etc to make things easier is a breeze, but tuning them to make them harder, without becoming silly and cheap would be no fun at all. Especially as I can't corner edit the majority of the level. Also, jack, as I recall the level is actually distinctly easier than when I first published as a direct result of your whining.... How does this sound... Once I've done the prettified version, I'll add an aced level prize. Collect that and I'll consider your extreme mode @v0rtex, welcome to the testing team. Although that won't happen for a while, as overhaul comes first, then dumbing down, and this will remain a side project.

2010-02-05 10:54:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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The sneak sensor was the primary issue TBH, that was specifically a 1-player only device and just doesnt' make any sense in multiplayer without explicit explanation of the mechanics, which is not something I was willing to do. At the point I decided I was definitely keeping that, it became a 1-player level so I had little sympathy for those who can't read the signs Now that's less of an issue, I intend to block up all of the multiplayer holes. Technically the sneaking will only be 2-player safe, but should give enough of an illusion of multiplayer safety that it will work with 3/4. Oh, from the original post I thought you actually solved 4 players. 2 players is easy. On the contrary, I found it quite enjoyable. Who are these people who can't appreciate a fantastic level when they see one? There's an important difference between appreciating and enjoying. You might appreciate the artful skill of the torturer, but not enjoy him practicing his skills on yourself. That's actually a pretty good analogy for this level.

2010-02-05 11:54:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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I don't know if it's good to ask here... You must do what you have to do with your level, you must do what you feel, so if you feel to do a remake, just do it. What you delivered the first time was fresh, unique and amazing, you do know what you have to do. Don't listen to people, just surprise and amaze us! Just one thing...please don't waste thermo with intros, I know the name of the level and the author before entering the level Anyway, please let me have the pleasure to beta test it again.

2010-02-05 12:49:00 Author: OmegaSlayer Posts: 5112

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No new level anytime soon then? : ( I'm still looking forward to a new one from the resident logic-meister....!

2010-02-05 13:08:00 Author: julesyjules Posts: 1156

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Oh, from the original post I thought you actually solved 4 players. 2 players is easy. It's not quite as easy as you might think. Tracking the position of two separate players is easy, but getting it to detect velocity of both accurately without interference from the other player and without it being exploitable in any way (depending on what techniques you use there are various loopholes in the system), is actually kinda tricky. I'll be using a fusion of two different velocity tracking methods implemented on both trackers, to ensure that it is fully awesome. There's an important difference between appreciating and enjoying. Exactly, I don't want to undermine the integrity of the creation by dumbing it down, but providing an alternative so that more people can enjoy it is something I'm very keen on. Just one thing...please don't waste thermo with intros, I know the name of the level and the author before entering the level Oh god no, there won't be enough thermo for that even if I wanted to do so! Anyway, please let me have the pleasure to beta test it again. You can get involved with testing for easy mode. The redesign shouldn't need any testing beyond what I can do myself as the gameplay will not alter. No new level anytime soon then? : ( I'm still looking forward to a new one from the resident logic-meister....! Yes new levels soon. I have 2 projects well underway, one of which is largely complete but I have lost interest in (for now at least) and one which is going full steam ahead (ish). Both are absolute logic monsters, my primary aim is to blow a few minds with the sheer level of complexity of one of them

2010-02-05 13:12:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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It's not quite as easy as you might think. Tracking the position of two separate players is easy, but getting it to detect velocity of both accurately without interference from the other player and without it being exploitable in any way (depending on what techniques you use there are various loopholes in the system), is actually kinda tricky. I'll be using a fusion of two different velocity tracking methods implemented on both trackers, to ensure that it is fully awesome. So it's not just a combination of a left-most player tracker and a right-most player tracker? I would expect that to be accurate enough. It'll be interesting to see what you come up with.

2010-02-05 14:01:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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Aaw, an easy mode? The point of SS was its fun, looks, and challenge. If you ask me, I think this will take out all the fun

2010-02-05 14:51:00 Author: Testudini Posts: 3262

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No one's going to make you play the easy version....

2010-02-05 15:39:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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What do you mean you can't corner edit the level? Would too many connectors snap?

2010-02-06 00:53:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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A large amount of the level is made from very large, very complex objects very close together. Notice how any visible joins in the caves are jagged, rather than straight lines (yuck). It appears that rounding errors have caused some of these to overlap ever so slightly meaning they cannot be corner edited. Same thing as if you embed some gas in a material, you won't be able to use the corner editor to edit it (try that, if you're not familiar with it). So I literally mean I cannot corner the edit. To modify rocks in the caves I have to build thin layer overlaps then copy / cut out these from the main rocks. It is a very tedious process to edit corners

2010-02-06 01:37:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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But its like I have to play any remake or sequel to Subterrean Setbacks. Its way to awesome

2010-02-06 02:28:00 Author: Testudini Posts: 3262

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A large amount of the level is made from very large, very complex objects very close together. Notice how any visible joins in the caves are jagged, rather than straight lines (yuck). It appears that rounding errors have caused some of these to overlap ever so slightly meaning they cannot be corner edited. Same thing as if you embed some gas in a material, you won't be able to use the corner editor to edit it (try that, if you're not familiar with it). So I literally mean I cannot corner the edit. To modify rocks in the caves I have to build thin layer overlaps then copy / cut out these from the main rocks. It is a very tedious process to edit corners Just in case you haven't thought of it: If you cut down the line of where they join and are overalpping with a tiny bit of material so they become their own free standing materials again, you can then corner edit them however you need them...and then join them back up with the corner editor. Generally what I do!

2010-02-06 03:06:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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You can join two objects with the corner editor? 'Cause I'm seriously missing joining on the PSP.

2010-02-06 11:18:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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@Jack: Ahhh yeah that would potentially work. That would even be possible now I have dome free thermo @rogar, nope but you can overlap them in an annoying glitchy manner and then everythign gets locked down and hard to edit.

2010-02-06 12:29:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Bumpety bump. Status update: So I've got 2 player sneaking working. It technically has some bugs, in that death will trigger the alarm, but then maybe death counts as a loud noise? I think so. Plus you shouldn't really die whilst sneaking so that shouldn't be an issue. Final elevator is multiplayer safe now, and I know how to make the fade-to-black falls work well with multiple players (effectively only the last player will fall to the fade-to-black, the rest will be caught and killed higher up, hopefully preserving the camera angle. Secrets have been partially ported over to the new system, which has dropped by thermo down by one third of a bar (ZOMG awesomesauce!). Once I get all of them ported across then I should have even more to work with. This does change all the scorings as I'll have to normalise the cost of each secret to some degree. I intend to avoid this being an issue by upping the maximum score possible. This is in no way a cheap attempt to gain more plays as I release and everyone has to fight for the top spot again. Honestly Obviously collected objects, and stickers thermo is below that, so I actually have plenty to work with on the aesthetics front. Most of this will go into lighting, sound and additional detail around some of the blander areas. As I have some breathing room the intro scene will get an overhaul, 'cause it sucks. Also the boulder room needs some work. I haven't decided exactly what to do here, as the fade-to-black background (which I wanted to give the impression of a big cavern) doesn't really work that well. Obviously there are now other ways of creating a cavern, but whilst I'm relaxing my attitude towards glitch use moving forwards, part of me wants to keep this baby glitch-free still. IDK. Thoughts?

2010-03-06 16:25:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Ooh sounds awesome. I was one of those people in your original post. "Wow. 5 stars, but you made me cry." I'll have to check out the updated version when you're done! My favorite thing about the original was those huge jumps that looked impossible to cross but were somehow manageable. I thought at some points that you didn't want the player to go in that direction, simply because the gap was uncrossable. but It wasn't! They were incredibly well designed and well thought out, and honestly i found them hard, but not overly hard. I hope that, by making them easier, the level doesn't loose that sense of awe as you complete a jump you wouldn't think of making in 1000 years!

2010-03-06 18:23:00 Author: Duffluc Posts: 402

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I thought the original version left me with a feeling 0f accomplishment after i completed it. It could be difficult and sometimes frustrating, but thats part of the level. I actually had a lot of fun with one of my friends. I think its cool your toning it down for the less patient, and making it better looking is always a plus.

2010-03-06 23:25:00 Author: Jrange378 Posts: 573

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So I literally mean I cannot corner the edit. Yeah, that also happens when you have a "Ground" layer, and then try to use corner editor to make a thin layer over it. If you push it to hard into a corner, you can't corner edit the shape. You can, however, use a square shape and chip away at it with triangle, but this is very messy, and as rtm says, "yuck".

2010-03-06 23:42:00 Author: srgt_poptart Posts: 425

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Often you can't actually edit the shape well enough by cutting and merging with blocks though. Typically that needs neatening up with the corner editor and then you are back to square one! Jacks method looks quite good TBH, especially when it's a case of very fine tuning for difficult jumps etc. Apparently the new brain emitter secrets method is not working as well as I might have hoped, and I've also somehow destroyed the elevator at the end (it has no connectors all of a sudden ), so that's an extra task to add to the list!

2010-03-07 12:59:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Woah I missed this! So it's basically an easier, slightly modified version? No big changes then? I especially can't wait for your next, new primary project. If it ever comes.... Haha

2010-03-08 02:04:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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It's going to be a harder (yeah, I decided to make it slightly harder), prettier, multiplayer friendly version, with more secrets and then an easier version. I added a new section of gameplay in towards the end, which I really like, but is liable to kill most of you when you first see it It's another "think quick or die" section, with a very simple solution. Not entirely sure if anyone else is going to like it, but I do. The rockfall section where I introduce the cave moss is now actually dangerous too, you have limited time to get past that, rather than it staying safe until you get off. I'm also going to tune up the pumping room and the crushers to be more difficult again, like they were when I originally released. I have a few other ideas for additions, but this is going to depend on what the thermo's saying after the rest of the aesthetic updates. Aesthetically I've redone all of the existing lighting, which was a very tedious task of hunting down all of the existing lights, removing their wires, rewiring to new logic and adding additional supplimentary lights to what was already there. Worth it though as all the fire looks wonderful now I've started to play around with some ambient lighting, currently unsure what pallette to go with. As for other projects, there are two, but I've decided that I'm wholey uninspired by both of them. As it turns out I should never have tried to diversify my style and just produced another level in the vein of Setbacks. But we live and learn. I've done enough work on those two projects that I will be finishing them, I just don't really care that much

2010-03-08 11:54:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I should never have tried to diversify my style and just produced another level in the vein of Setbacks. Aw, that's no fun! I thought the Lab-y one looked great, but I know, uninspired and all.

2010-03-08 12:16:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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Really looking forward to the SS redux! I finished the original version which did take a while, but I enjoyed it all the same! So a harder version you say? Bring it on!

2010-03-08 12:22:00 Author: Rhys125 Posts: 841

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Oooh harder? I like that! I think you should make a totally new sequel (as in different story, yet still underground because it's your specialty) to Sub. Setbacks. I don't know how (and it sounds like it wouldn't be fun for you) but it'd be great, I know that for sure! EDIT: I think I'm trying to push mine own desires into your reality... You know what, I'ma just shut up now. :blush:

2010-03-08 19:46:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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I think you should make a totally new sequel (as in different story, yet still underground because it's your specialty) to Sub. Setbacks. I don't know how (and it sounds like it wouldn't be fun for you) but it'd be great, I know that for sure! ACtually I have no interest in a sequel, I played with the idea, but TBH, Setbacks is a self-contained entity. My concept for extension would have been an aftershock that splits the ground below the scoreboard and drops you (conveniently) by the sewer mutants again, so queue humourous exchange, followed by a (even more convenient) rearranging of the opening scene so that you can head off to the left and explore that part of the sewer. But that's not happening. In honesty it's the gameplay style that people like about this level and I could probably work that into a lot of environments (as long as they aren't too sturdy lol). I enjoyed building gamplay directly into the scenery, and the complex geometry of the caves was fun for that reason, but I think forests, swamps, mountains, ruined citidels might work as well as caves etc. for that kind of thing.

2010-03-08 21:08:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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A secrets counter? Will there still be point bubble combos? How exactly would the secret work? Would you have to grab a stone or something?

2010-03-08 21:12:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Didn't wanna do grabbables, especially as most of the secrets are hidden out of sight. Depending on how things turn out, It's liable to be a "special" points bubble. A secrets counter is highly unlikely now, you'll be pleased to hear. I probably can afford the thermo for it, but I'd rather not. Plus with the extra secrets, that's going to be a wall of nearly 40 lights, which would just be silly The combos will mostly be the same. In essense the scoring will work out similar to before, around 40% combos / 60% secrets, although that may skew slightly in favour of the secrets now. @comph, somehow I missed that last post. Yeah I'll finish that one off and publish, even if "finishing it off" turns out to be little more than a rebuild of the existing puzzles with a couple more thrown in and little polish. I do like the concept, just stretching it to an entire level is just not interesting. Far to methodical and sterile for my liking.

2010-03-08 21:19:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I am very pleased Why not use more score bubble and less point bubbles?

2010-03-08 21:22:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Ummmm, what? Where exactly are you thinking? I could do that in a couple of places, but that would cost more thermo than an offscreen brain emitter. As I've been finding out this weekend, it would be less of a headache than an offscreen brain emitter

2010-03-08 21:25:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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ACtually I have no interest in a sequel, I played with the idea, but TBH, Setbacks is a self-contained entity. My concept for extension would have been an aftershock that splits the ground below the scoreboard and drops you (conveniently) by the sewer mutants again, so queue humourous exchange, followed by a (even more convenient) rearranging of the opening scene so that you can head off to the left and explore that part of the sewer. But that's not happening. In honesty it's the gameplay style that people like about this level and I could probably work that into a lot of environments (as long as they aren't too sturdy lol). I enjoyed building gamplay directly into the scenery, and the complex geometry of the caves was fun for that reason, but I think forests, swamps, mountains, ruined citidels might work as well as caves etc. for that kind of thing. Yeah, I believed that's what you'd think! Haha! I thought the same thing about it being self-containing. It just wouldn't seem right if a level was to branch off of it in any way. Your idea sounds good, yet I see why you wouldn't want to do it. Ruining the charm of the first would probably be a consequence of a sequel to some. Also, about building into the scenery; I believe that is one of the best ways to make a memorable, enjoyable level. I don't particularly like it when a level has a great, "real-life" atomosphere to it and then a cartoonish, out-of-place gameplay piece comes in. I mean don't get me wrong, some creators can really pull it off well (i.e. Grantos and jackofcourse), but the majority of LBP creators can't seem to get it right, in my opionion. Yeah there's my long speech from the depths of my brain... *phew!* Sorry for my off-topicness. So, is there a solidified release date, or is it a go with the flow type deal?

2010-03-08 23:46:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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Also, about building into the scenery; I believe that is one of the best ways to make a memorable, enjoyable level. I don't particularly like it when a level has a great, "real-life" atomosphere to it and then a cartoonish, out-of-place gameplay piece comes in. Julesyjule's latest was brilliant for that actually. The scenery was high realism, but then he's throw in some cartoony floating logs. The level actually benefits from this IMO. But as you say, it's far from easy to pull off. Don't worry about dragging my threads off topic, I'm awful for that myself, so we'll be fine So, is there a solidified release date... Do you have any idea who I am

2010-03-09 01:36:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I simply mean: Will you replace groups of 5's of point bubbles with a score bubble to save thermo? I take it you're keeping brains but most likely doing away with secrets? What's your stance on how you think brain combos will work? ---- Edit: Do you have any idea who I am XD

2010-03-09 01:37:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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I simply mean: Will you replace groups of 5's of point bubbles with a score bubble to save thermo? I take it you're keeping brains but most likely doing away with secrets? What's your stance on how you think brain combos will work? There are very few groups of bubbles simply lying around the place, and swapping them out would alter the combos so 5 bubbles != 1 prize bubble. Brain combos don't work. Aya thought he'd got something to work with paintballs but that wasn't stable, then I thought I'd got it to work and it also wasn't stable. I'm probably just going to hope that future updates don't include something that activates the combo on switch-activated brains, pop 10 at a time and get 500 points.

2010-03-09 01:40:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I just remembered I'd thought of a very clumsy but decently effective idea I was going to post on your help thread. What about a constant stream of poppable brains flying through the air that run their lifetime through before they pop? Then have a wall that can move back and fourth into the line to pop them?

2010-03-09 01:45:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Vulnerable brains don't give out any points at all if killed by a hazard, if that's what you mean. We tried that one, it was highly confusing

2010-03-09 01:46:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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I just edited while you posted. I meant poppable. Still, they don't? Interesting....

2010-03-09 01:47:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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No, and we tried firing poppable brains at a wall and they didn't pop! It's all a big mess really.

2010-03-09 01:50:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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lol. We? What about firing paintballs directly at the brain's core? That seems to work with paintinators in create mode.

2010-03-09 01:52:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Oh, so paintballs hitting brains is the new thing? I'd only heard of that in a few levels but if incinerator and rtm talk about it then it must be the best way! So you're trying to find the most efficient way to use ONE brain emitter to give out point? If so, I'll try to devise some less-than-stellar concept, but if not, could you please clarify it a bit? And rtm, I thought you had everything planned out until your death! ;]

2010-03-09 02:02:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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Nah, lol, just a thinking-out-loud idea.

2010-03-09 02:06:00 Author: Incinerator22 Posts: 3251

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Nah, lol, just a thinking-out-loud idea. But come to think of it, it would be more efficient than point bubbles, in theory....

2010-03-09 02:50:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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Oh, so paintballs hitting brains is the new thing? Well if you actually shoot paintballs at a brain, it pops and is eligible for combos, but if you emit paintballs at it, it may or may not pop. Weirdly it may pop when you play the level, then not the second time you play, or when someone else plays. However, the technical aspects of brain popping should probably be kept in the other thread: https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=23557-Emitters-brains-points-and-lots-of-bugs-%28

2010-03-09 10:52:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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Well if you actually shoot paintballs at a brain, it pops and is eligible for combos, but if you emit paintballs at it, it may or may not pop. Weirdly it may pop when you play the level, then not the second time you play, or when someone else plays. However, the technical aspects of brain popping should probably be kept in the other thread: https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=23557-Emitters-brains-points-and-lots-of-bugs-%28 Hmmm... Alright. I'm going to experiment with the brains when I get on LBP. They sound interesting!

2010-03-11 00:18:00 Author: piggabling Posts: 2979

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