Archive: 28 posts

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I've recently come back from a long break from LBP. Before I left I started an original story level, kinda based on Final Fantasy, and now I'd like to get it finished. This is my second attempt at this level, the first attempt overheated way too quickly, but now I'm having some issues with the boss, and with some pacing elements. The boss is kinda like a guy in Magitek Armor, or a Mecha if you haven't played FFVI. And instead of going the easy route with the paintinator, I've decided to make the battle turn based. There are four commands Phoenix Down, which spawns a 3-life checkpoint, and Fire, Ice and Lightning, which deal varying amounts of "damage" with their own "effects" using thin layer emitters. The bosses health and the basic command system I can figure out, using a counter and a few multi-way switches, but what I can't get my head around are the bosses attacks, and the timing. Sackboy's don't exactly have "health" so for one thing I need to find a balance between platforming hazards and turn based attacks. I'd like the boss to have a few different options for attacks, and have it choose one at random (or a weighted randomisation) to use on each turn. At least one of them should be unavoidable and unblockable, but the rest should be survivable. Secondly I need a little logic guidance on the insane amount of multi-way switches I need to make each turn tic over as I select a command and for the boss to attack at the right times. Nearly all of these things I can manage on their own, it's just linking them all together into a smooth running system I can't figure out. I've published it as locked, so let me know if you'd like to help and I'll send you a key. EDIT: https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=t=19737 Level is complete. Still some bugs to work out though, would appreciate feedback in my showcase thread.

2009-12-04 18:01:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Hey Welcome back. I love FF although I only really got into it from FF7 onwards. 7 and 9 are my faves. You might like to check out my FF7 cutouts which I made ages ago before I knew how to use the corner edit tool properly. I was going to make an FF7 level using the cutouts but unfortunately I couldn't shrink them any smaller than they are without losing lots of detail. I would love to help but am very busy with other projects right now. I wish you luck though and look forward to seeing your level.

2009-12-04 18:13:00 Author: mistervista Posts: 2210

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Saw your cutouts, brilliant detail. I've used some custom 'sack-sized' cutouts for characters in my level, they look just like other sackpeople. XD Edit: I guess not many people view this forum.

2009-12-04 20:45:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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I'm a FF fan (haven't played earlier than VII though), sounds like a cool level, so I wouldn't mind taking a peek. I already have one suggestion: to me the fire, blizzard and thunder spells don't sound very strategic, I'd go with a more varied selection like fire, bio, gravity for example. That is, unless the boss can gain immunity to one of them as a special move or something, in which case forget I said anything.

2009-12-05 00:03:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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Well it's actually part 1 of... well, many, and it's the 'first' boss basically. You start off with three crystals, fire, ice and lightning. Upon defeating the boss, you gain another crystal. So there will be more spells available in later parts. I intended one of the spells to be more effective than the others, and one to 'heal' the boss, so it's not entirely strategic, just a short puzzle to figure out before a kind of survival challenge.

2009-12-05 00:08:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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I've also noticed that two of my speech bubbles are censored, and I have no idea why. They are: WARNING! Entering Authoria without Magistrate consent is punishable by death. and It's an old legend that the crystals were once immortal beings who grew tired of life...

2009-12-05 00:21:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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I've also noticed that two of my speech bubbles are censored, and I have no idea why. They are: WARNING! Entering Authoria without Magistrate consent is punishable by death. and It's an old legend that the crystals were once immortal beings who grew tired of life... There is a thread on the forum somewhere if you search for censored words that lists a lot of the possible censored words and parts of words. Oh and there are lots of people viewing this forum. Don't be disheartened, it's because there are so many that some threads get overlooked for a while because there are tons of new threads going up all the time and it's difficult to keep up with them all. As Bon Jovi would say 'Keep the faith'

2009-12-05 02:53:00 Author: mistervista Posts: 2210

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Turned based fights...awsome idea!!! I hate paintonator bosses You CAN give sack boy health by first immobilizing him or keeping him in a confined space when the battle is on. Then just use a paintonator health bar or a man-made one to represent health, once it hits 0 BAM hit em with something invisible and lethal. There is a randomizer in the logic pack for the bosses attacks unless you want an order.

2009-12-05 04:28:00 Author: Littlebigdude805 Posts: 1924

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Hm... actually giving sackboy health sounds like a brilliant idea now. Then I wouldn't have to worry about any platforming nuances. I can change Phoenix Down into Potion and just stick a single three-life checkpoint down. I'm going to go rethink the battle now, and look up those censored words, thanks guys. You can still add me as a friend if you want to check out the level so far. XD

2009-12-05 10:10:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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It's Entering and Immortal that are censored. ******, I can change entering but I have a feeling there aren't going to be any synonyms for immortal that will read well in that sentence.

2009-12-05 10:15:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Yeah the censoring issue is a real pain. There is a thread about it as we've discussed it at length before. In my W.I.P. Sheriff Sack 2 level I had a magic mouth saying there was a stampede of horses but that was censored too. I found out it was 'stampede' even though it says stampede on the speaker sound I used. I had to change that completely because I just couldn't think of another word for stampede.

2009-12-05 13:41:00 Author: mistervista Posts: 2210

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I went with 'undying', doesn't sound too bad. Could use 'charge of ...' or 'onslaught' for stampede.

2009-12-05 13:50:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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I just played the Class demo level. Very interesting concept . I've always liked the idea of a LBP RPG (which reminds me, check out Jagrevi's Ama Toor project, you may like it). Anyway, I like the idea of multiple classes, and while I do not know if you choose one class at the beginning and move on from that, I will say that the second mechanism thing that raised platforms was very annoying and took me like ten minutes to do :/. Ah well. So, will you have "levels" like level 1, 2, 3 and more powers as you progress, or what? ;o. Hm, intriguing concept to say the least, and I wish you luck :kz:

2009-12-05 15:17:00 Author: RockSauron Posts: 10882

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Actually I scrapped the classes, I tried to implement them in my first attempt I mentioned, but I barely got anywhere before it overheated. So I started again by making it purely a story level, with as much detail as possible. The boss battle should be the only 'gimmick' in that sense.

2009-12-05 15:20:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Actually I scrapped the classes, I tried to implement them in my first attempt I mentioned, but I barely got anywhere before it overheated. So I started again by making it purely a story level, with as much detail as possible. The boss battle should be the only 'gimmick' in that sense. Oh... in that case then, um... Well, might you be able to incorporate the mechanist puzzle? I like the idea of building things... though it'd be cool if you had to grab onto the building sponge the whole time... anyway, yep.

2009-12-05 15:23:00 Author: RockSauron Posts: 10882

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It's really coming along now. Still some timing issues to figure out but I have the health system all sorted. That's practically the basis of the whole system, the actual attacks are just for show really, so it's really just aesthetics to do now.

2009-12-05 22:50:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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The only issue I have now is that the bosses attacks are triggered by switchs using flip pistons. The annoying thing is, everytime I start the level and sometimes when I unpause, they all flip out, and it uses all of it's attacks at once. I can work around the unsynching of the system this causes, but a couple attacks have global lighting settings, which then affect you when you start the level. For instance, I don't want everything turning purple until the boss uses it's death-ray, but it uses it's attacks when the level starts so everything turns purple for a few seconds during the intro.

2009-12-06 22:50:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Well it's actually part 1 of... well, many, and it's the 'first' boss basically. You start off with three crystals, fire, ice and lightning. Upon defeating the boss, you gain another crystal. So there will be more spells available in later parts. I intended one of the spells to be more effective than the others, and one to 'heal' the boss, so it's not entirely strategic, just a short puzzle to figure out before a kind of survival challenge. Oh, I think that's pretty strategic for a LBP level. Regarding the lighting changes on entry, have you tried making it so it only triggers when the player is near? Like, proximity switch + AND gate.

2009-12-07 16:12:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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Oh, I think that's pretty strategic for a LBP level. Regarding the lighting changes on entry, have you tried making it so it only triggers when the player is near? Like, proximity switch + AND gate. Actually, there is one stage I might be able to stick another AND in, that might just work.

2009-12-07 17:52:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Also, I have been considering a system in which the boss' immunity and weakness to each of the three elements rotates. Visual cues I can figure out, but in regards to actually changing the outcomes I'm a little stumped. The attacks work by triggering a three-way flip OR switch, for three different attacks, that turns on a hidden paintball emitter and the HP is a dissolve countdown triggered by a paint switch. The attacks do varying damage in that each flip switch is set to a different duration. The powerful attack triggers a 2.5 second switch which sets off 2.5 seconds worth of paintballs, thus taking off more HP, whereas a weak attack triggers a 1 second switch, etc. I can't think how I would change that outcome. The only thing I can think to do is a delay switch with a rotating receiving mag-swtch, which triggers an AND that feeds into the attacks, which would allow for one of the three attacks to deal damage while the other two do nothing. I just can't think of a way to make it vary, so that one attack does full damage, while another does minimal damage and the other does no damage.

2009-12-07 18:03:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Well, like I said, considering it's only the first boss you could leave it as is. But a relatively simple solution would be to have the boss switch between only two elements, e.g. fire and blizzard. Then you can leave thunder connected to the 1 second switch. The 2.5 second switch would be connected to (fire-attack AND fire-weak) OR (blizzard-attack AND NOT fire-weak). Fire-weak would be whatever decides the current weakness, when it's not TRUE, it's ice-weak. I find you can usually simplify constructions that have the same input on both sides but inverted (hope that makes sense), so the logic might be reasonable.

2009-12-08 12:09:00 Author: Rogar Posts: 2284

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After playing an almost finished battle, I felt it was lackign something in regards to gameplay. So as I still have some thermo to spare, I figured it would be a good idea to look into a rotating weakness/defence system. The more I think about it, the more I think it will be possible, so when I get back today I'll see about drawing up a plan. Plus I think it'll add more depth to the level, as you will need to 'discover' how the elements relate to each other (eg. fire kills ice, ice kills lightning, lightning kills fire, yeah, doesn't make too much sense, lightning killing fire that is) throughout the level. And i've already got a plan for giving that information. XD

2009-12-08 12:59:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Well I've finally finished it, or got it to a playable standard at east, I'll still make some adjustments. Its unlocked so check it out if you can and I'd appreciate feedback.

2009-12-09 23:57:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Um, k so I played. The hole in the wall in the room next to the crystals to proceed was rather hard to find. Also, the guy said he hacked the elevator system, but the elevator wasn't at the bottom and I was stuck so I couldn't continue >_<

2009-12-10 01:27:00 Author: RockSauron Posts: 10882

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That's never happened to me before. There's no reason why the elevator shouldn't be at the bottom if he's there, they both run off the same switch and it's always been reliable. I'm sure it won't happen on a second playthrough. Perhaps I can add another subtle arrow pointing upwards on that room though.

2009-12-10 09:29:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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I'll set up a proper thread with some pictures tonight, and I'll still keep on top if this level, see if I can figure out what went wrong with that elevator. But after that I'll be starting on Part 2. XD

2009-12-10 13:29:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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There, that tunnel should be clearer now, and I've tweaked the elevator mechanism. It didn't look like it would have fallen out of synch but I can't think it was anything else.

2009-12-10 18:00:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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Just a few pics to entice you guys to play it. XD http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_1-1.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_2-1.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_3-1.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_4-1.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_5.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_6.jpg http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y98/seraphor/APhoto_7.jpg Ok I've set up a level thread, would appreciate feedback left in there rather than here. https://lbpcentral.lbp-hub.com/index.php?t=t=19737

2009-12-10 19:21:00 Author: TheSeraphor Posts: 73

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