Archive: 31 posts

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WARNING: long thread I've spent loads of my time in LBP. And most of you have to. In fact, I never spent so much time with a game. But I'm afraid that this is not the main point of this thread. The main point of this thread it's the "compromise" that LBP generates, wich tends to grew stronger the more time you spend on it. And I'm pretty afraid of that fact, since the last time I experienced this was while playing "World of warcraft" a few years ago. That experience was awful; there were times on wich I wanted to quit, because, you know, there were other things going on on my life, but I had a compromise, not with the game, but with the people trough it. Not that this is something bad; wich is negative are the effects that it can generate. LBP has a main objective, wich is fun. But sometimes, I felt a little obligated to go into create mode and work a little on my current level. And lately, I've been hanging out with Mammett-box (creator of a "Royal love letter" series) and we've decided to work on something together. I do really want to, but hell, it takes time. And all that time goes to creating levels. When I end them, I feel satisfied. But, is it really worth to use that much time into making levels? What are levels? Levels are nothing. They are completely intangible. The day you get bored of LBP, they'll dissapear for you, and you'll possibly look back and ask yourself on what exactly did you spend so much time on. Yes, it's true that LBP is more rewarding that other games, but still, OUTSIDE of the game itself, whatever you create ingame holds no use at all. So, I might hang out less with friends sometimes, or do less homework, or sleep less, or whatever, in order to create something that I might despise a year later. Sure, I'm having fun at the moment I play LBP, but isn't it curious how LBP makes us feel productive when we aren't for real? "Es como construir castillos en el aire" (spanish expression: it's like building sand castles on the air, meaning something that will become useless after putting much effort into it) Don't get me wrong, I love LBP (and LBPC!), but isn't it unrewarding in the long run that we spend so much time perfectioning our level creating skills when these are something that could just vanish in the air if, for example, Mm decided to close the servers one day? Or if we decide to quite the games? We'd just be left with our hands empty in exchange of all that time and effort. Discuss. (tee hee, I get to say "discuss", as Jackofcourse does!)

2009-09-30 20:56:00 Author: Keldur Posts: 628

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Levels are nothing. Nothing anyone will ever do can possibly make any kind of difference to anything at all, everything is nothing, nothing you or anyone else does will ever matter. You only live once, so do whatever the hell you want in order to enjoy it.

2009-09-30 21:03:00 Author: ARD Posts: 4291

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[edit] Most Epic (with capital E) game that i have ever played. Before this i had no online experience, then i got ridiculously addicted, creating levels and playing online, spending outrageous amounts of time playing, something about it, its like playing it is its own reward, i still remember the time i started playing the "magic" of the game, however unless you meet every creator in real life, once you turn the console off, suddenly everything changes, and all what you just spent hours doing becomes a memory till the next time you turn it on. Its because i realsed this that lead me to take some time out from LBP, concentrate on "real life" You only live once, so do whatever the hell you want in order to enjoy it. That is now in my sig

2009-09-30 21:10:00 Author: springs86 Posts: 785

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If I look at my life in terms of "what tangible things have lasted as a direct result of my actions" I could say that 99% of the experiences I have had no tangible and lasting outcome. Doe this mean that the experience was not worth it? That 99% of my life is meaningless? Maybe, but I've had a great time for the most part. Some things are worth it for the experience at the time. Most things are. I feel that creating in LBP is one of those things. That you are neglecting other experiences for this one is maybe something to look into. Especially as you sound burned out and quite resentful of it. I know what you mean about WoW - I quit that game as well for the same reasons. But I think LBP is something different. There was nothing to feel intrinsically proud of in WoW. But I can take pride in my LBP creations on an intellectual, artistic and even emotional level, even if it doesn't truly matter beyond my living room and the immediate future

2009-09-30 21:16:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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"The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time." - Bertrand Russell

2009-09-30 21:38:00 Author: mrsupercomputer Posts: 1335

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I don't think LBP is going to die. It's just too much fun. Take Warhawk, for example. In case you didn't know, it's an online game where the main perk is air-to-air combat. The game came out two years ago, and it still gets players. The last update for the game was a year ago and the community is still playing. My point is that ground-changing games like this simply will not just stop being played (unless LBP2 comes out, but still there will be people playing the original), and to think so is rather foolish. Plus, life's short anyways. Do what makes you happy at the moment and plan to do so in the future.

2009-09-30 21:46:00 Author: SLS10 Posts: 1129

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You can apply that to any game you've ever played. No matter how good you are at it, it translates into nothing physical and tangible. My question to you is, does it really matter? I don't play LittleBigPlanet or create levels because I am looking to get something physical out of it, I create and play because it is fun. If you are making levels for any other reason than fun, I'll tell you right now that you are playing LittleBigPlanet for the wrong reasons. Let's apply this pessimistic state of mind to other things: Why bother posting on this forum, how does it benefit you in real life? The answer is that, quite simply, it doesn't. If it benefits you in anyway, it's in your knowledge of LittleBigPlanet which is the object of question in the first place, thereby nullifying that point. Why bother helping someone who falls down? Why return a wallet to someone who drops it? We don't do things because we are driven by the need for physicality, we do things because we are human, and we feel the need to satisfy our arbitrary and intangible desires. We have fun and help others not because of what we will receive in return or get out of it, but rather because we are human and those are things we feel. This is a reason why so many people are still religious. Why pray to something you can't see? Not only are the results not tangible, the means through reaching this end are intangible as well. Yet so many feel the need to oblige. It is because emotion and feeling are not tangible things, but we still need them.

2009-09-30 21:51:00 Author: BSprague Posts: 2325

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Once again, the incredible accuracy of the game's name, "LittleBigPlanet" comes into play. This game is its own world. There's an audience within the game, of players who experience all this custom content. You can become famous within LittleBigPlanet. This game presents its own microcosm of art and commerce in the real world. It's the people who spent so much time devoted to creating levels that are the heart and soul of this game. You have to keep in mind that you're essentially going into another world for the periods that you spend creating and playing and publishing. You step through a doorway when you turn the game off and return to the other endeavors of your neglected life. And when all is said and done, and when people move on from this game and the play counts on those million+ levels stop rising - Then keep in mind that this is a pioneering, revolutionary game - There will be so, so many more of this type of community-driven experience in the future, and every time one of these comes out, it will harken back to this one. You were there in the beginning. It's pointless to downplay the significance of this game and the time you spend in it, because while it may seem like a waste when you look around you and realize 100 hours have dropped out of your life because of this one level, it's still left its own indelible mark on "LittleBigPlanet". We step out of that when we switch this game off. I know exactly how you feel, I go through this myself quite often. But this really is more than just a videogame. It'll always hold a special place for me - I'll remember LittleBigPlanet when I'm old and withering away, and uploading my brain into the human supercomputer.

2009-09-30 21:52:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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This is true for every single video or computer game. It's all just moving pictures on a screen. However, some of those moving pictures restore memories, make us laugh, inspire us, entertain us, and in LittleBigPlanet's case, brings the world together.

2009-09-30 21:55:00 Author: Frinklebumper Posts: 941

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When it comes to this thread, It actually relieves me that people proves me wrong. That doesn't mean that I won't try to prove myself right anymore. Rtm, I actually felt proud of what I achieved in WoW. More or less in the same way I do in LBP. That's why I feel a bit of a deja vu sensation. And I wouldn't take pride on my LBP creations. Let's say that I meet a guy that tells me that he can sing very well, and asks me what I'm good at. I would never answer that i've got some skills on level creating in a game called LBP. It's just not on the same leage, IMO. However, rtm223, you are right on that not many actions result on tangible things. It's just that LBP levels feel to me, well, even less tangible than intangible things, if you get what I mean. You just need to suffer a data loss to experience that sensation. I've worked so hard on something so unreliable. Nothing anyone will ever do can possibly make any kind of difference to anything at all, everything is nothing, nothing you or anyone else does will ever matter. My english sucks, I couldn't understand this. You only live once, so do whatever the hell you want in order to enjoy it. I couldn't agree more. Just note that I'm trying to apply this with a sense of time perspective in mind. "The time you enjoy wasting is not wasted time." - Bertrand Russell What is wasted time and what not, it depends of it's consequences, to me.

2009-09-30 22:01:00 Author: Keldur Posts: 628

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You can apply that to any game you've ever played. No matter how good you are at it, it translates into nothing physical and tangible. My question to you is, does it really matter? I don't play LittleBigPlanet or create levels because I am looking to get something physical out of it, I create and play because it is fun. If you are making levels for any other reason than fun, I'll tell you right now that you are playing LittleBigPlanet for the wrong reasons. Let's apply this pessimistic state of mind to other things: Why bother posting on this forum, how does it benefit you in real life? The answer is that, quite simply, it doesn't. If it benefits you in anyway, it's in your knowledge of LittleBigPlanet which is the object of question in the first place, thereby nullifying that point. Why bother helping someone who falls down? Why return a wallet to someone who drops it? We don't do things because we are driven by the need for physicality, we do things because we are human, and we feel the need to satisfy our arbitrary and intangible desires. We have fun and help others not because of what we will receive in return or get out of it, but rather because we are human and those are things we feel. This is a reason why so many people are still religious. Why pray to something you can't see? Not only are the results not tangible, the means through reaching this end are intangible as well. Yet so many feel the need to oblige. It is because emotion and feeling are not tangible things, but we still need them. This ^ Brilliant post - and I'd have it in my sig if it would fit. Perspective is what you need. I'm sure a lot of people have had the same thought as you, I know I have. I'll think, "I've been on LBP all day, why?" Why not? There's never a forever thing, but as long as the fun continues, I'll take a bit of it to feel happy.

2009-09-30 22:09:00 Author: MrsSpookyBuz Posts: 1492

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I don't see the difference between playing any game and creating a level in LBP. The only thing you are doing is "playing a game" and that's time you decide to invest or not. Not game is "useful" for your life. Their only use is to entertain you. The only question you can ask yourself is "do I take too much leisure time that it affects my quality of life or not?" Also, Mrsupercomputer slashed this thread already. .

2009-09-30 22:35:00 Author: RangerZero Posts: 3901

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Unless your name is Johnee creating over the last 12 month has been a waste of time. A very enjoyable and in some cases highly productive waste of time.

2009-09-30 22:38:00 Author: Syroc Posts: 3193

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Brilliant. Just that word. Wait. I said others! Whatever. Just BRILLIANT.

2009-09-30 22:41:00 Author: chezhead Posts: 1063

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no game will give you anything physical but that doesnt mean its not worth the time lbp is the closest thing to a rewarding video game i know you gain friends experience knowing a good time is that not worth anything?

2009-09-30 23:08:00 Author: Littlebigdude805 Posts: 1924

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And I wouldn't take pride on my LBP creations. Let's say that I meet a guy that tells me that he can sing very well, and asks me what I'm good at. I would never answer that i've got some skills on level creating in a game called LBP. It's just not on the same leage, IMO. Heh, I would actually do the opposite. I AM proud of my LBP creations.

2009-09-30 23:13:00 Author: Nuclearfish Posts: 927

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You know, I probably have a bit of a different perspective. Many here are enthralled with others playing their creations.... but I already had that rush MANY years ago. Personally, I think of LBP as a game, such as any other video game (and I'm GOING to be playing video games anyway) in which I not only get the joy of creating fun for others, but I get to be entertained by them. So, yes - it IS just a game, and it isn't necessarily productive time... but for "entertainment" it's much more rewarding than most other video games I've played. But, just as anything else - be balanced, and have priorities. I was able to build Splat Invaders III very slowly, a little bit every night after the family had gone to bed, and come out with something that seems to be entertaining people - and I had a blast doing it. Now for my 7-year-old, who gets limited to 1 hour a day in video games, I feel it's FAR more productive than any other video game because he's learning logic and basic programming concepts.

2009-09-30 23:20:00 Author: CCubbage Posts: 4430

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Now for my 7-year-old, who gets limited to 1 hour a day in video games, I feel it's FAR more productive than any other video game because he's learning logic and basic programming concepts. Your a horrible and wonderful father all at once CCubbage. The gamer in me is raging but the adult/wanna be parent - says excellent decision. Does that include his building level time too? If so he's even more talented than we already think he is

2009-09-30 23:38:00 Author: Morgana25 Posts: 5983

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Yes it does - LBP is a game, and building a level is playing a game. Besides, if he plays too long when will I build MY levels?

2009-09-30 23:44:00 Author: CCubbage Posts: 4430

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I hope to be rich enough so I can have my gaming room and i'll buy my kids their own console. When they are too crazy, I will tell them to go see their mom and i'll go continue to build my level in my gaming room. .

2009-10-01 00:42:00 Author: RangerZero Posts: 3901

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I hope to be rich enough so I can have my gaming room and i'll buy my kids their own console. When they are too crazy, I will tell them to go see their mom and i'll go continue to build my level in my gaming room. . Little cages are cheaper....

2009-10-01 01:32:00 Author: CCubbage Posts: 4430

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Thanks a lot, Nietzsche! I feel utterly redundant as a sentient lifeform now.

2009-10-01 18:26:00 Author: Ungreth Posts: 2130

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I do agree to a certain extent. At times the pressure I put myself under to create is just ridiculous. I'll be like, 'I haven't created anything today, I'm really lagging behind my schedule, I need to make something...' What schedule? Who imposed this deadline? I'm just playing a game here, why do push myself to create and make levels when I'm not really in the mood? At times it moves over from a hobby to an obsession or even a job, and for what? I have no idea! I've guess I've always had that dream of working for Mm, and I think some of the pressure I put on myself could stem from that. Maybe not so much a job, but at least recognition for what I've done so far. I guess part of me keeps creating because I feel like...'Hmm still not formally recognised...looks like I need more then! Back to create mode!' That probably sounds a little self-centered and like I'm creating for the total wrong reasons. I'm not saying that's the only reason I create by a long stretch. I LOVE this game. But there's no doubt part of me creates with this in mind. I think we all do to some degree. I don't really have this feeling as much any more but it was definitely evident when making Tribal Ruins, as I've said many times on here, most of that I didn't really enjoy creating and was just making it to add another level to my collection. I think most avid creators have experienced something similar to what is being described in this thread. Remembering it's just a game is quite difficult at times, it's so interactive, because you can do whatever you want in it, you really can lose yourself at times. The community side of things adds to this as well, especially places like this forum.

2009-10-01 22:33:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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I do agree to a certain extent. At times the pressure I put myself under to create is just ridiculous. I'll be like, 'I haven't created anything today, I'm really lagging behind my schedule, I need to make something...' What schedule? Who imposed this deadline? I'm just playing a game here, why do push myself to create and make levels when I'm not really in the mood? At times it moves over from a hobby to an obsession or even a job, and for what? I have no idea! I've guess I've always had that dream of working for Mm, and I think some of the pressure I put on myself could stem from that. Maybe not so much a job, but at least recognition for what I've done so far. I guess part of me keeps creating because I feel like...'Hmm still not formally recognised...looks like I need more then! Back to create mode!' That probably sounds a little self-centered and like I'm creating for the total wrong reasons. I'm not saying that's the only reason I create by a long stretch. I LOVE this game. But there's no doubt part of me creates with this in mind. I think we all do to some degree. I don't really have this feeling as much any more but it was definitely evident when making Tribal Ruins, as I've said many times on here, most of that I didn't really enjoy creating and was just making it to add another level to my collection. I think most avid creators have experienced something similar to what is being described in this thread. Remembering it's just a game is quite difficult at times, it's so interactive, because you can do whatever you want in it, you really can lose yourself at times. The community side of things adds to this as well, especially places like this forum. How true Jack... I couldn't agree more with you

2009-10-01 22:47:00 Author: poms Posts: 383

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Nothing anyone will ever do can possibly make any kind of difference to anything at all, everything is nothing, nothing you or anyone else does will ever matter. You only live once, so do whatever the hell you want in order to enjoy it. I have to address this first - Ard... Ard... Ard... that is a rather pessimistic way of looking at the world : ( That is the complaint of someone who's suffering from some kind of disappointment (whether that person is you or someone else). I think those that outlawed slavery, fought for racial equality and sexual equality, who advanced science to the point we're at now, would disagree with you. Things we do make a difference - always - even if it's purely to the refining or degrading of our own characters. And people like Hitler, Robert Mugabe, Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Jesus Christ, Bill Gates, and I add your own parents to this list - did things (great and terrible) that made a very big difference to a LOT of people. Okay that's said. Now onto topic... I think I understand the issue of 'compromise' you spoke of Keldur. I find myself constantly at odds with my decisions regarding how to use my time and extended periods on LBP (that I manage to squeeze in whenever i can) still leave me feeling like I'm compromising, but more in terms of the lifestyle of my family as I have so many people and things relying on me (mother of 2 teens and a toddler = massive time/emotional investment required, which I'm happy to do 99% of the time, I teach on the weekends, am involved in volunteer community service and am also managing a very stressful and expensive subdivision of our property, and trying to run a household somewhere in amongst all that while my husband often travels for work... So while everyone has their obligations and responsibilities, I have a few more than say the average 16 year old LBP player. And those responsibilities would take all 24 hours of my day if i let it - but I don't because i need my sanity and LBP helps me regain it. However, when I spend copious, euphoric amounts of time playing or creating, even with my kids, things fall through the cracks here at home and at some point I have to say 'enough'. While the intangible LBP world I go to is tangible in terms of how it effects me, there are more important things I need to be doing, especially for those in my home who can't do for themselves yet. I know that's probably very boring to most of you, but I think while LBP is worthwhile in many ways to me - and my kids (and all the creating leaves no mess!!) - there's a real need for judiciousness, knowing when to walk away and live in the real world. But let me tell you, coming from a family with a strong strain of Asperger's and high functioning autism, fighting the obsessiveness can be a daily battle. That's my 2 cents... : )

2009-10-01 23:57:00 Author: BabyDoll1970 Posts: 1567

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I know that's probably very boring to most of you, but I think while LBP is worthwhile in many ways to me - and my kids. I think it's the exact opposite, BabyDoll! Firstly, I think it's very honest of you, and secondly, it's not boring at all - certainly not to me. It's brilliant that people like you and CCubbage and others play LBP with their kids. I don't have any children (unless you count SpookyBuz! lol), but I would hope to do the same as you do. Good post! Er... sorry everyone... back on topic... :blush:

2009-10-02 00:09:00 Author: MrsSpookyBuz Posts: 1492

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I think it's the exact opposite, BabyDoll! Firstly, I think it's very honest of you, and secondly, it's not boring at all - certainly not to me. It's brilliant that people like you and CCubbage and others play LBP with their kids. I don't have any children (unless you count SpookyBuz! lol), but I would hope to do the same as you do. Good post! Er... sorry everyone... back on topic... :blush: 100% agreed. Thank you BabyDoll, definitely an insightful post. This has turned out to be a fantastic and meaningful thread. There's been a lot of honesty in it.

2009-10-02 00:21:00 Author: jackofcourse Posts: 1494

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Thanks, you guys xox I'm not kidding about the obsessiveness (!), so if you see me on here or online a bit too much, I may well benefit from the occasional "don't you have something else you should be doing, BabyDoll?" prompt. LOL... or not. Edit - To further illustrate the point of my post.. while focusing intently on typing it up, my toddler found a pink crayon and has drawn all over the floor, and my white couch : )

2009-10-02 01:14:00 Author: BabyDoll1970 Posts: 1567

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Nothing anyone will ever do can possibly make any kind of difference to anything at all, everything is nothing, nothing you or anyone else does will ever matter. Well... As long as I'm going to live in this world, I might as well make it the most enjoyable and fun and fair place I can make it. --Bill Hicks So, um...That's one way we can make a difference...Right? Anyway, I cannot deliver my, "To be, or not to be" soliloquy since, well, I'm still very young, and that's probably why I enjoy the game as much as I do. Sure, I know some day I will look back and think, god, what was the point? But to me, right now, it's just fun. I love to have no boundaries or limitations on my creativity - in music, art, whatever, and this game combines everything and allows other people to enjoy what you have made. You. I guess it's just the fact that people are able to know what you're capable of that keeps me creating, and if I can make people say, "y'know? This guy's pretty talented", then I'll keep doing it. *cough* Anywhom, did that just make any sense?

2009-10-03 14:58:00 Author: KoRnDawwg Posts: 1424

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Where to begin? Let me go back to the beginning with the "castles in air" thing. Henry David Thoreau wrote in Walden, "If you have built castles in the air, your labor need not be in vain. Now just lay the foundations under them." So I'd like to lay a few foundations. Some of you have posted that the point is all about fun. And I agree. It is extremely fun, but even better, it's fun with a purpose. As I have played many of the levels created by many of you, I can't help but be amazed. I'll see something and then try to figure out how you did it. It's learning. I also get the chance to problem solve, use logic, etc applied to creating things. I think that people are fundamentally creative, but sadly, too many people never discover an outlet for that creativity. Well, fortunately we can say that doesn't apply to us. More importantly, our outlet taps into so many different aspects of creativity. Music, art, storytelling, puzzle making--the list could go on. As far as time goes. I too have a 7 yr old. She is limited in her game time, but I also limit her to LBP and a few other non-violent, non-scary games. It's a way we can spend time together. My wife isn't a gamer at all, but she does like to play LBP now and then. That so many busy adults make time out of their busy days to do this is a real testament to its being worthwhile. All things considered, I think I can agree with Thoreau. I like castles in the air. They are usually way cooler than the real ones, so many of which are crumbled ruins today.

2009-10-03 15:53:00 Author: thanatos989 Posts: 248

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I have to address this first - Ard... Ard... Ard... that is a rather pessimistic way of looking at the world : ( That is the complaint of someone who's suffering from some kind of disappointment (whether that person is you or someone else). I think those that outlawed slavery, fought for racial equality and sexual equality, who advanced science to the point we're at now, would disagree with you. Things we do make a difference - always - even if it's purely to the refining or degrading of our own characters. And people like Hitler, Robert Mugabe, Mahatma Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Jesus Christ, Bill Gates, and I add your own parents to this list - did things (great and terrible) that made a very big difference to a LOT of people. I can assure you, I'm a very optimistic person And I was thinking on a much bigger scale than those examples. People come and go, some are remembered, but in the long run, no one matters. I know it sounds harsh, but it's true. Enjoy your life and those of the people close to you, nothing lasts forever, so do what you want, when you want.

2009-10-03 16:04:00 Author: ARD Posts: 4291

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