Archive: 21 posts

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I was going to bump my old motion control thread, but that was a discussion that took place during E3, so we've had a bit of time since then. So instead I'm just going to open up a conversation about specifically Sony's upcoming motion controller. I'm sure some of you saw the update on the Sony blog, but if you missed it, this is seriously worth watching. (http://blog.us.playstation.com/2009/09/motion-controller-update-part-iii-deep-dive-into-the-e3-demo/) It's a step-by-step, in-depth demonstration of the E3 demo, with a few added bells and whistles. The motion control truly does look like 1:1, very solid, and in a way the Wii never accomplished. The style of motion is completely different as well - The Wiimote is a "pointer", whereas the Sony controller is more of a "wand", which you move in 3D space, and it measures it fully, front to back, left right up down, twists, turns, etc. The drawing demonstration was very impressive, because anyone who's tried that with a wiimote knows it's impossible to do that kind of precision. The really important tidbit is that these guys say that they're only developing tech - they're leaving it completely up to the developers to decide what to do with it. That's a bit troubling. In the film industry, there's a constant give-and-take between the artists and the technology. A cinematographer on a big film can talk to the manufacturers of any camera, light, tripod, lens - anything they could possibly need for their film - and have them custom modify or create something entirely new for them. There's constant communication between the manufacturers of the technology and the craftsmen who use that technology as their paintbrush. As a result, technology influences technique, and technique influences technology - all at once. But here, it kind of sounds like these guys found a way to create a really cool, state of the art motion controller. So they did it. And that's that. Then they place it in the hands of the developers and trust that they'll come up with something cool. But what if developers discover that the buttons are insufficient? That holding a wand in that fashion over time is extremely uncomfortable in most positions that they require it for? There's a rumor that seems to be legit, that Sony has plans to launch this thing in Japan this coming March (http://gizmodo.com/5364945/playstation-3-motion-controller-slated-for-march-dreamcast-titles-inbound). If this is happening so soon, this device is almost out of prototype stage. I think a big opportunity may be missed here in the rush to release this thing - most certainly along with "PS Eye" style mini-games. Who knows how long it might be before we finally see full-fledged games that properly support it in a meaningful way. I'd rather see it delayed a full YEAR if it means working head-to-head with developers to create a killer app, if it means Sony will put their full weight behind it and bundle it with all new systems, if it means modifying and testing and evolving and NURTURING this thing, along with the game creators, until it's the right controller. Instead, what I think we're going to get is an experiment. It will show a lot of promise, there may never be widespread support for it, but it's probably nothing more than a testing ground for future controllers - and control schemes - and systems. So those are my thoughts at the moment, though the tech looks impressive, and I can't wait to get my hands on this thing. If a developer can really create something amazingly immersive that works, that feels new and makes progress, I'll rush to the front of the parade and march with the flag.

2009-09-23 10:51:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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Hmmm... if it's gonna be published in Japan on March, it should be published in Europe...about April or May? Hopefully I don't have to wait too long (the Finland thing, **** it) Oh, and I certainly hope that they'll make some kind of analog stick and stuff in the controllers and of course, buttons. Because if they won't, it'll be just a friggin' casual-minigame scam.

2009-09-23 13:30:00 Author: Oerjeke Posts: 234

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Hmmm... if it's gonna be published in Japan on March, it should be published in Europe...about April or May? Hopefully I don't have to wait too long (the Finland thing, **** it) Oh, and I certainly hope that they'll make some kind of analog stick and stuff in the controllers and of course, buttons. Because if they won't, it'll be just a friggin' casual-minigame scam. it woulde be cool if it looked like a REALLY stremlined ps3 controller and it had all the buttons and stuff, but if you tilted it vertically you could use it as a motion controller

2009-09-23 14:49:00 Author: Unknown User

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it woulde be cool if it looked like a REALLY stremlined ps3 controller and it had all the buttons and stuff, but if you tilted it vertically you could use it as a motion controller Yeah. Pretty much like the Wiimote. I don't care if it's a rip-off. As long as it's awesome! CAN YOU IMAGINE PLAYING MGS WITH THIS CONTROLLER?!?!?

2009-09-23 15:10:00 Author: Oerjeke Posts: 234

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Well, it definitely has buttons as they show off in the video, but they've stopped short at actually showing the controller up close and demoing its full features. How many buttons? How are they situated? I don't like holding a wii-mote pointed at the screen for an extended period of time. That appears to be a potential problem with this one as well, unless game developers choose to have their games controlled with the wand in its upright position. It needs to be really comfortable, and this really doesn't look like it was designed for comfort (neither is the Wii's controller). It also still needs to have enough buttons/aux controls to be able to handle the sort of ridiculous complexity games tend to have these days. I'm really worried that if they ARE releasing it in March in Japan, that they won't have any REAL games ready for it, just little "apps". Minigames, tech demos. I think they're hurting themselves by doing this (assuming they ARE doing this).

2009-09-23 21:55:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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My mind is thoroughly blown. The fantastic thing about this wand is that it's so much better than the WiiMote. There's so much more you could do with it, it seems, such as moving around that room.

2009-09-23 22:16:00 Author: qrtda235566 Posts: 3664

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Here's the thing. Even if they do release it in Japan in the spring, that's not to say it was rushed. Before E3, no one knew about this, so who knows how long it was in production? Maybe they waited to long to announce it so that they could release it soon after the announcement, because all the testing was done. Just a thought.

2009-09-24 01:46:00 Author: dandygandy2704 Posts: 1002

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Here's the thing. Even if they do release it in Japan in the spring, that's not to say it was rushed. Before E3, no one knew about this, so who knows how long it was in production? Maybe they waited to long to announce it so that they could release it soon after the announcement, because all the testing was done. Just a thought. Well, I'm already sold on the tech. The thing looks amazing. I want one BAD. What worries me is that, even now, the developers of this thing are saying, "we don't have any games that utilize this yet, just some tech demos, but we're just going to leave it to the developers to cross that bridge." I just think it's backwards to release this thing without a killer app. If they had one brewing, if SOMEONE had SOMETHING brewing, I'm sure by now there'd be even a modicum of hype being stirred up about it - but nothing. crickets. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a big reveal. Maybe at TGS, that's right around the corner?

2009-09-24 02:03:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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Wow, so the Sony keynote's over at TGS. They did confirm that the motion controller would be coming out in the Spring (in Japan at least), but didn't seem to discuss any software support whatsoever. They certainly didn't show any. Microsoft's conference included an extensive list of huge developers who are currently developing for Natal. Sony didn't seem to have anything like this behind their controller. From IGN's keynote coverage: " The controller will be released in Spring 2010. He says they plan on making it a standard controller to follow Dual Shock. " Interesting. Not sure really what that means. Does "follow" mean "replace"? If so, it is audaciously early to make a claim that big at this point, without a single game to back it up. So far, my disappointment stands - Sony needs to seriously throw their weight behind this thing or nothing's going to come of it. Microsoft's Natal was even mentioned on a segment on The Colbert Report. I'll give Microsoft that much - they're putting WEIGHT behind that thing. And yet I'm way more excited about Sony's "wands" than Microsoft's "nothing". I think getting rid of a handheld controller period might be a bit ahead of its time for right now. EDIT: So Sony just had their conference, and there were a couple of very juicy motion-control tidbits. RE5 is going to be rereleased as an "alternate version" featuring motion control. It sounds a bit like a Wii rip-off scheme - in one hand you hold the Dualshock, and in the other you hold the wand. So it's pretty much identical to a wiimote+nunchuck, only you have an entire dual shock in one hand. Pretty weird. Nonetheless, I'm disappointed that it's not going to be a patch, but an entire re-release. Hopefully they have some kind of trade-in deal. And none other than LittleBigPlanet itself will benefit from the new motion controllers. They only showed a multiplayer demo, where one player uses an onscreen cursor, controlled by the wand, to manipulate the environment as player 1 uses a dualshock to play traditionally. No details on if this will be supported in create mode. But obviously that would be incredible. So this is one of my big questions answered - with the controller out right around the corner, what is Sony doing to support it? Well, it looks like they're offering motion control patches and versions on already-released games. Including PSN titles like Flower (that's going to be incredible). I'm considerably more excited now, but more than a little bummed that there's no killer app to unveil.

2009-09-24 05:13:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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Hopefully they won't screw it up... Just two wands: one holds the trigger, triangle, square, circle and X and the other one has the analogs and shoulder buttons. Maybe a bit hard to make

2009-09-24 13:18:00 Author: Oerjeke Posts: 234

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Just like XBOX's redundant Natal project, I think this looks stupid. You're playing a video game. If you want to go run around or move around go outside and actually do it. When you're playing a video game all you want to do is simply move your fingers (cause we're lazy s.o.b.'s ). If I wanted a silly Wii I would have got one. Definitely not going to get this silly update, it's a waste.

2009-09-24 19:03:00 Author: ChristmasJew Posts: 431

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Before E3, no one knew about this, so who knows how long it was in production? Actually, we saw the designs for it like 2 or 3 years ago. :S

2009-09-24 19:15:00 Author: ARD Posts: 4291

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do you have to use the motion thingy with a camera? i really hate cameras

2009-09-24 19:34:00 Author: springs86 Posts: 785

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Resident Evil rerelease? Come on, can't you at least make it DLC? D: LBP... yeah, I was thinking LBP would fit in with the Motion Control thing... in Create Mode, i mean. But yeah... we need something actually worth getting it with :/.

2009-09-24 21:10:00 Author: RockSauron Posts: 10882

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Resident Evil rerelease? Come on, can't you at least make it DLC? D: LBP... yeah, I was thinking LBP would fit in with the Motion Control thing... in Create Mode, i mean. But yeah... we need something actually worth getting it with :/. Yeah, that ****** me off a good deal. Other games are receiving patches, like Flower. Is it such a huge thing to implement that you have to rerelease the game? Or is the beast that lives in Sony's cellar screaming for more money to eat? But, RE5, man I've played that game so much I don't know if I'm that interested in playing through it again, motion controls or no. do you have to use the motion thingy with a camera? i really hate cameras Yes, you need a PS Eye for this to work! Don't worry, you don't have to watch yourself play. But this is an issue too - people don't just buy the wands, they also have to buy a PS Eye for this to work. And even after all that consumption, there's still no original title that fully takes advantage of the thing. I'm skeptical that this will do very well, unless it gets delayed or Sony has an Ace up their sleeve (but why not show that at TGS??).

2009-09-24 22:07:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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Maybe, since you need a PS Eye, as well, they'll release some sort of bundle thing. I mean, hey, Endwar was bundled with a headset to play with, so why not this? By the way, does this have an actual name, or is it just "Sony Motion Control Stuff"? Also, did anyone else think that Natal looked a lot like what we were doing with a PS Eye last gen? I mean with the "It senses where you are and it does stuff" thing. That was the first thing I thought when I saw it. It came out and I literally shouted "IT'S JUST A PS EYE!" at my TV.

2009-09-24 22:30:00 Author: dandygandy2704 Posts: 1002

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Well, Natal includes an IR camera that provides 3D detection and added precision, as opposed to the PS Eye, which is just a pixel camera and can only detect movement in 2D space. You can look at it as a glorified PS Eye, but I think the precision it offers is a HUGE bonus over what the PS Eye can do. I think the best of both worlds would be the way to go - use Sony's wand controllers, with a Natal-type combination camera instead of just a pixel one.

2009-09-24 22:47:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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Well, I don't really know that much about the tech behind the PS Eye and Natal and the differences and all that. But that one tech demo that was just a glorified version of Breakout had me calling shenanigans, since I'm almost positive something similar was released on PS Eye... A Natal-Sony hybrid would be really cool. Kinda like what the Wii should have been, no?

2009-09-24 22:55:00 Author: dandygandy2704 Posts: 1002

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Kinda like what the Wii should have been, no? Man if that ain't the truth. This tech was available, and not too pricey, when the Wii launched. It's a crying shame we got what we got with the Wii: A cheap remote-control style IR sensor and a couple of accelerometers. I guess it's to be expected that widespread motion control would have growing pains. We've still got a ways to go. it looks like even Sony's controller is a bit Wii-centric, with the "wand" shape, and the RE5 support that requires both a dualshock AND a wand. There's a solution, we're getting closer, but it looks like it's still going to be a little while. In the meantime, I'm excited to see what's possible with each iteration.

2009-09-24 23:50:00 Author: Teebonesy Posts: 1937

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YouTube - ?TGS 09? PS3 ?????????*?? ???????5 ?EyeToy?. I think it would have been smart to joystick to the wand.

2009-09-25 12:36:00 Author: Syroc Posts: 3193

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the RE5 support that requires both a dualshock AND a wand. This to me is a big mistake. I see they don't wanna make us buy a wand AND a cam AND a left hand controller, but I tried controlling the left analogue stick and left shoulder button on a dualshock without touching it with my right hand and it's not pleasant. You have to use your 4th and little finger along with heel of your palm and the leverage of the right hand side drooping makes it really unbalanced. I was constantly shifting my grip to accomodate for it. Maybe it's something you get used to but I honestly can't see it being at all comfortable for more than 5 minutes at a time and someone with small hands is going to struggle to get the leverage to hold it and use the controls. If they are going to do this then I'd ask them to please create a properly designed left hand stick, and let those that can't afford it use the standard dualshock, don't force us all to use something not fit for purpose.

2009-09-25 12:49:00 Author: rtm223 Posts: 6497

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