Archive: 20 posts

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Hey all! I'm a new member on these boards, and wanted to share a pretty large project I've been working on. If you read my intro post, you'll know that even after playing LBP for a few months, I haven't yet published a level. However, I have been inspired by quite a few different videos and sources and friends to step into the possibility of creating music levels. I've always loved music. However, I've never had much musical talent when it comes to playing an instrument. I can read sheet music well, I understand -most- of the lingo, but I just lack the physical skills to play an instrument. However, I am skilled with programs and tools to perhaps... mix music I've been creating a player piano skeleton level. What I mean by skeleton level is, a level I can copy on my moon for each song I want to do, so I don't have to recreate everything. I've done searching on google/youtube and using the musical tag in game, and have only come up with the "Roll Over Beethoven" level as somewhat of a player piano level. The piano still "played itself", but used sponge on pistons to do it. Still, it is an amazing design and inspired me to go for a level for once, instead of just making objects. I'm not sure how the creator of that level did it, but I'm fairly confident I'm doing it differently. Please let me know if there are other levels out there that use a player piano, as I'd be interested in playing them and puzzling over how the creator managed it. This project has taken a mind-numbing amount of work to do. Its been spread out over the past month and half and I still don't have a full song "programmed" into it yet. In fact, I dont really have a handful of measures programmed in. All I have is a few test measures to calibrate my system for dynamic BPM changing (as a skeleton level, I thought a method to change the BPM easily would be necessary, and it even opens up the idea of making music in which the BPM changes during the song). One thing that has really been holding me back, however, was the method of delivering the notes to the piano. I finally found one that functions almost verbatim like a classic player piano, but I ran into timing issues hardcore. I expect to overcome those issues tomorrow though, as I have a few ideas scribbled down in my notebook that I'm going to explore. I'll then test the system, tweak it as needed, and hopefully I'll have a song up for you all to enjoy by the end of the day. I'm not too sure I want to go really in depth on how I've managed to create it thus far, mainly because I went through a lot of hardships creating the thing. The piano itself went through around 8 or 9 major revisions with a few minor ones, and the method of delivering the notes to the piano went through around 4 100% level altering designs. Not to mention all the temp optimizing I've done (it has never gotten close to the point of overheating yet, but given my method of delivery I wanted to make sure there is plenty of space). I've also got a few things planned on the aesthetic side, though that needs a ton of work too. I may publish it as just the song, and then republish it with the additions. The system is sort of in place for what I would like to do, but I want to change some of it around. In any event, what are you all's opinion on a player piano music level, and has it been done already and I just didn't search hard/long enough? Also any tips for things I should possibly do would be appreciated, it would be my first level and while I understand first levels may not always be the best, I do want mine to at least be well polished. I also might start taking commissions after I get a song or two through the door.

2009-09-18 04:01:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Phew, long post. I haven't searched for them, but i haven't seen too many either. Typically music levels are just the "sit on a vehicle" or "run across the screen" with maybe some visuals. I'd probably say full steam ahead if you havent found any similar ones, this sounds rather interesting. Incidentally, what song do you plan on playing?

2009-09-19 17:56:00 Author: Burnvictim42 Posts: 3322

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Woah hey, sorry for not getting back sooner. I was wrapped in working out the kinks in the system, and there still are a couple that need fine tuning. Sorry about the long post. >_> I do tend to rant when I'm on something. The song I'm doing is an infamous one. Its the original U.N. Owen Was Her? that eventually spawned that mess of mcdonald insanity. I plan on publishing v.1 here in a few, though it still has a couple of issues with speeding up and slowing down (barely noticeable unless you listen for it), but so far I haven't found a workaround to them without completely breaking it xD. I think the reason why it breaks (though v1 is stable) is simply because I'm making it more complicated then it needs to be. I basically have a column of emitters and my own system for a variable length piston to sequence when they get activated. When one gets activated, it pops a line of music onto a conveyor belt that moves it to the reader bar. Each line (except the last) is set up to activate the piston again to emit the next, and so on. An interesting idea as it saves a lot of vertical space in the level, but it chomps through thermo like mad. UN Owen is probably the longest song I'll be able to do with this method. I'll be reworking it for my next songs.

2009-09-22 00:12:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Sounds interesting. New member here, robalabob (hope I got that right), actually has a similar type music level with a piano that plays itself. You might want to check it out. Maybe you guys can bounce ideas off each other... Cheers.

2009-09-22 00:35:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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Thanks! The level is published now, just search for my psn (Mennenth) and its my only level so far. (hovering over japan, closest cool spot to where it initially came up)

2009-09-22 00:38:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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can't search out your PSN due to current search issue they're working on. Leave a comment on someone's level so we can get to your profile that way.

2009-09-22 00:40:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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Will do. I'll play a couple of levels right now so I can also see what people have made

2009-09-22 00:43:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Will do. I'll play a couple of levels right now so I can also see what people have made Cool. Please let us know after you post a comment on someone's so we can reach yours. ... I hope they fix the search function for new levels soon ...

2009-09-22 00:48:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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Just posted one on your demo level Jagrevi. I played through a bit, I thought the intro was pretty cool! I'll get to commenting on a couple more in a couple of hours. I forgot the new season of House begins tonight 0_o

2009-09-22 00:52:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Playing yours right now - I really wish you'd build a level around this set piece - it's great. Perhaps a run through a haunted mansion, where you fight a boss on top of a piano that plays itself? It would be particularly effective if you didn't telegraph it ... they were just running across the piano when all of a sudden ... Sat through the whole thing twice, got to the scoreboard, 5 stars.

2009-09-22 00:59:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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g. The song I'm doing is an infamous one. Its the original U.N. Owen Was Her? that eventually spawned that mess of mcdonald insanity. I plan on publishing v.1 here in a few, though it still has a couple of issues with speeding up and slowing down (barely noticeable unless you listen for it), but so far I haven't found a workaround to them without completely breaking it xD. Ahaha, my firends are addicted to the franchise from whence that came.... it's a good song too, I'llpop by soon to hear it!

2009-09-22 01:55:00 Author: Astrosimi Posts: 2046

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Playing yours right now - I really wish you'd build a level around this set piece - it's great. Perhaps a run through a haunted mansion, where you fight a boss on top of a piano that plays itself? It would be particularly effective if you didn't telegraph it ... they were just running across the piano when all of a sudden ... Sat through the whole thing twice, got to the scoreboard, 5 stars. Thanks man! That is actually a pretty neat idea that I didnt think of. If I were to do the same song, I might have to simplify it or figure out a different way to make the piano play. The level is practically overheated, I doubt there would be enough room for a boss. Maybe an awesome haunted mansion, but definitely not a boss xD Thanks for the 5 stars as well! Good to know my first level has made it off the ground, even though it isn't as perfect as I would have liked. I'm still going to be working on improving that version. If anyone can't find the level, just let me know and I'll drop a comment off for you tomorrow so you can get to it. I can't at the moment as I have class in the morning.

2009-09-22 03:06:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Thanks man! That is actually a pretty neat idea that I didnt think of. If I were to do the same song, I might have to simplify it or figure out a different way to make the piano play. The level is practically overheated, I doubt there would be enough room for a boss. Well since different thermos are mutually exclusive, you could still include a boss in the level that was extremely high in detail as long as they didn't require much logic. Hmmm ...

2009-09-22 03:14:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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Well since different thermos are mutually exclusive, you could still include a boss in the level that was extremely high in detail as long as they didn't require much logic. Hmmm ... Oh that is true. lol. I keep forgetting the temp in create represents the highest of several. xD. I'm not too concerned about the logic side of it though. The skeleton level I made does not even come to 1/4th total heat, and I'm dead sure that is the logic temp. Tons of switches, pistons, and emitters, not to mention the sound objects. It doesn't start to get hot until I add the lines into the primary emitters... Now that I think about it, the message it gave me for overheating is from the collected objects. (19 emitters, each emitting one line of music onto the track... yeah...) When I get a chance, I'll see if I can just make a boss as it is in the level.... drat that makes me wish I had the mgs pack. I know just what I would do...

2009-09-22 03:26:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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drat that makes me wish I had the mgs pack. I know just what I would do... Just get it. It's the one DLC that's actually worth the cost (assuming you have the means to get it).

2009-09-22 05:07:00 Author: comphermc Posts: 5338

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Just get it. It's the one DLC that's actually worth the cost (assuming you have the means to get it). Well, the one thing preventing me from getting it right now is simply because neither the ps3 in the house nor the copy of the game is mine xD. Both belong to my brothers girlfriend, but because she practically lives with us I get to play when she is off doing something else. I've been hoping she'd pick up some the DLC's, but it doesn't look too hopeful. I have plans though. If it gets to her b-day or x-mas (whichever happens first) I'll pick up a few for her, even though I'd more then likely have to re-buy them when I finally get my own ps3 and copy of the game. Oh, I also noticed someone tagged my music level with "lousy" online, but I didnt recognize the psn. I guess that is true, it only uses one instrument... at the moment. So, I'll be working on the next logical step: more instruments xD. That is, once I drastically reduce its current heat. While that is only 1 bar of many heat levels, I still have a powerful urge to keep everything cool. I'm still going to make the haunted mansion though, I've been drawing up some ideas for one in my notebook. I'll just have to make some extra... accommodations

2009-09-23 01:18:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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I'm still going to make the haunted mansion though, I've been drawing up some ideas for one in my notebook. I'll just have to make some extra... accommodations oooooh .... I'm looking forward to this one.

2009-09-23 01:43:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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oooooh .... I'm looking forward to this one. It might take me a while to complete it. I'm not too good with level design just yet, but the haunted mansion idea gave me a flood of ideas. Thanks so much for the suggestion, I don't think I would have thought of that and would have just created horizontal levels that go <entrance><piano><exit>. I'm definitely going to push myself to actually make a full blown level now. I'll probably still be scribbling away at the general layout of the place for a couple more days. My previous attempts at making levels has been pretty much just going at it, which is probably why I never liked them. So, I'll try the plan it ahead approach, and revise as needed when things break or other shenanigans occur.

2009-09-23 01:52:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Jagrevi, I am saddened to inform you, but that haunted mansion is going to have to wait a bit longer then planned. I've decided to use a different song because of the direction I'm taking the level. But in order to do that song any sort of justice I'm having to redesign my piano some. Scratch that, quite a bit actually. And it will not be the full song, but it will be a teaser for the second music level I plan on making The primary overhaul is figuring out a better system to read the music. After putting all the lines of music for U.N. Owen into a blank level and making them dark matter and connecting them and all that fun jazz, the heat hadn't gone down any. It simply uses too many magnetic keys (easily hundreds of them). So I'm reducing the amount of keys needed to a maximum of 49 for any song and changing my reader bar to work off of sprung bolts (instead of the measures bringing the keys to the switches, the measures will push the keys into the switches), bringing it even closer to how a classic player piano actually functions. My fear though, is that this design will also overheat because of the amount of objects/vertices needed to make the notes, based on what that 3rd MM tips video said. I'll also be normalizing the size of the measures/lines (something I should have done for U.N. Owen) in order to get rid of that hideous speed-up/slow-down thing it does sometimes. I'll give you a hint for the song though; it involves mixing a bunch of the sound objects together to get the piano to sound as close to an organ as possible.

2009-09-30 00:20:00 Author: Mennenth Posts: 52

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Jagrevi, I am saddened to inform you, but that haunted mansion is going to have to wait a bit longer then planned. I'll give you a hint for the song though; it involves mixing a bunch of the sound objects together to get the piano to sound as close to an organ as possible. That sounds interesting though, at least. Please keep up the work.

2009-09-30 00:32:00 Author: Jagrevi Posts: 1154

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